Formatted email font size problems

J

john

Don't be to hard on her, The e-mail clients between PCs and Macs do try to
look for a compatible Font even is you think they should be the same, they
are not. The issue may be as simple as screen resolution. If you write this
person, you may have to experiment.

Good Luck
john
 
H

henryn

Folks:

Entourage 2004 Version 11.3.3
MacOS 10.4.8

I'm exchanging formatted (HTML) emails with a complete non-tekkie, and I'm
unable to explain to her:

(a) Why she shouldn't use formatted (HTML) -- she feels that she should be
able to use color, text formatting, different fonts, etc, in her emails --
which means she expects my responses to be formatted, too, and...

(b) Why portions of my messages I send in 18pt Times are often rendered on
her system as 10pt Times or smaller, too small for her to read.

This person is so non-technical it has been hard to find out what email
client she is using. Finally: I found out it is Outlook Express V6 PC.

Her emails to me show some font size shifts but in the other direction, say,
she sends 12pt Times, I see 14pt Times. To me these one-size shifts are
acceptable, are in the better direction for readability, and they are easy
to explain by hand-waving.

Ideas?

Fixes -- ones that are consistent with her requirements and abilities?


Thanks,

Henry

[email protected] remove 'zzz'
 
D

Diane Ross

Entourage 2004 Version 11.3.3
MacOS 10.4.8

I'm exchanging formatted (HTML) emails with a complete non-tekkie, and I'm
unable to explain to her:

(a) Why she shouldn't use formatted (HTML) -- she feels that she should be
able to use color, text formatting, different fonts, etc, in her emails --
which means she expects my responses to be formatted, too, and...

(b) Why portions of my messages I send in 18pt Times are often rendered on
her system as 10pt Times or smaller, too small for her to read.

This person is so non-technical it has been hard to find out what email
client she is using. Finally: I found out it is Outlook Express V6 PC.

Under View --> Source you can often find what email client is used to send.
Her emails to me show some font size shifts but in the other direction, say,
she sends 12pt Times, I see 14pt Times. To me these one-size shifts are
acceptable, are in the better direction for readability, and they are easy
to explain by hand-waving.

Ideas?

Fixes -- ones that are consistent with her requirements and abilities?

On your end use one of the rules here:

http://www.entourage.mvps.org/rules/example/rule010.html

I suspect there is nothing you can do to change this person's preferences.
Send responses to her in plain text. This way she will be able to read your
mail.


--
Diane Ross, Microsoft Mac MVP
Entourage Help Page
<http://www.entourage.mvps.org/>
One of the top five MS Entourage resources listed on the Entourage Blog.
<http://blogs.msdn.com/entourage/>
 
H

henryn

Diane Ross:

Thank you for your response:

Under View --> Source you can often find what email client is used to send.

Right.

The main point of this was that my friend is not very technical at all.

That's clever! I never saw that action. I really need to look at that
entire list closely when I have a chance. And I need to look up the
meaning of the action "burst", which sounds a bit ominous <grin>.

As I said, the errors on my end are in my favor and slight. It wouldn't be
helpful to me to increase the font size further.
I suspect there is nothing you can do to change this person's preferences.

She prefers to use a feature apparently supported by the product she is
using, and she cannot see why she cannot.
Send responses to her in plain text. This way she will be able to read your
mail.

Yes, that's the only alternative.

My query was how to _explain_ to her that she must give up colors, text
styles, font choices, etc. when the application apparently supports those
options?

Alternatively, could you give or point me to a brief explanation of how it
is that font sizes are so badly mangled in formatted messages between these
two applications, both of which apparently support formatted messages?
Tekkie talk is fine with me, no worry.

Thank you very much,

Henry

[email protected] remove 'zzz'
 
D

Diane Ross

She prefers to use a feature apparently supported by the product she is
using, and she cannot see why she cannot.

You could try with.... every client doesn't support the same features and if
you want your message to be read, it's best to send plain text. Save the
fancy stuff for your friends that can read it or want it. Stress "want".

Fonts can be set for plain text and HTML. The settings for plain text only
affect what YOU see and not what the sender receives. The receiver will see
the messages with THEIR preferences. When setting plain text, choose what
you like. This is a great feature, especially if you like larger fonts for
easy viewing. However, the font and size you choose for "HTML messages
(proportional)" do reflect the default font for outgoing HTML mail and is
the what recipient will see.
Alternatively, could you give or point me to a brief explanation of how it
is that font sizes are so badly mangled in formatted messages between these
two applications, both of which apparently support formatted messages?
Tekkie talk is fine with me, no worry.

I'm not the right person to explain the techie part. I do know it's getting
better between mac and pcs.

FAQ) How come text from Entourage appears so large when I send it to my
friends using Windows?

It has to do with the way that monitors connected to Windows systems display
images. Windows displays the screen picture at 96 dpi, while the Mac
displays the screen picture at 72 dpi. Because of this, messages that look
normally sized on the Windows computer will be small on the Macintosh. On
the other hand, messages that look normally-sized on the Macintosh are
magnified when they are shown on Windows displays.

You're best bet to get around this is to send your messages in plain text
(make sure the Format -> HTML option is unchecked). What the PC user sees
then only depends on his/her settings to display plain text messages.
Alternatively, you can change the font size to "Smaller" before sending so
that the messages appear at a more reasonable size on the receiving end.

HTH
--
Diane Ross, Microsoft Mac MVP
Entourage Help Page
<http://www.entourage.mvps.org/>
One of the top five MS Entourage resources listed on the Entourage Blog.
<http://blogs.msdn.com/entourage/>
 
H

henryn

Diane Ross:

Thank you for your email:

You could try with.... every client doesn't support the same features and if
you want your message to be read, it's best to send plain text. Save the
fancy stuff for your friends that can read it or want it. Stress "want".

Hmmm, I've tried that, but it it isn't very convincing. It seems to me akin
to saying, "When driving in the rain, don't use the windshield wipers if you
_want_ to see clearly."
Fonts can be set for plain text and HTML. The settings for plain text only
affect what YOU see and not what the sender receives. The receiver will see
the messages with THEIR preferences. When setting plain text, choose what
you like. This is a great feature, especially if you like larger fonts for
easy viewing.

Yes, of course, this gives lots of control, but it also requires people to
understand that "_word_" means that "word" is intended to be italicized,
which is not easy for non-technical users. When a user sees that actual
italics can produced, it is a bit difficult to persuade him/her that he/she
cannot actually send italics.
However, the font and size you choose for "HTML messages
(proportional)" do reflect the default font for outgoing HTML mail and is
the what recipient will see.

I think that should read "...is, in theory, what the recipient will see, but
often will not." Correct?
I'm not the right person to explain the techie part. I do know it's getting
better between mac and pcs.

FAQ) How come text from Entourage appears so large when I send it to my
friends using Windows?

It has to do with the way that monitors connected to Windows systems display
images. Windows displays the screen picture at 96 dpi, while the Mac
displays the screen picture at 72 dpi. Because of this, messages that look
normally sized on the Windows computer will be small on the Macintosh. On
the other hand, messages that look normally-sized on the Macintosh are
magnified when they are shown on Windows displays.

You're best bet to get around this is to send your messages in plain text
(make sure the Format -> HTML option is unchecked). What the PC user sees
then only depends on his/her settings to display plain text messages.
Alternatively, you can change the font size to "Smaller" before sending so
that the messages appear at a more reasonable size on the receiving end.

Thanks! Perhaps some tekkie will see the following and comment:

The rendering on any given platform must take into account the actual DPI of
the display used by that platform -- that's how displays and their software
drivers work, the only way any kind of size constancy can occur.

Also this theory does not explain the uneven rendering my friend observed,
with one paragraph sent in a given size rendered in one size and some other
sent in the same size rendered in a completely different size.

Next, the FAQ question explains why messages from Macs to PC's show up
larger on PC's, but that's not at all what we observed. (In this case and in
a completely different one, too.) The formatted text I send shows up
smaller in many cases, but never larger.

Even if the DPI difference was the cause, it should be roughly in
proportion, but the ratio of 96 dpi to 72 dpi is much different than the
ratio of approximately 2:1 we've seen.

When using formatted email, there is certainly room for variation because
the sizes specified in the underlying HTML --which are NOT point sizes, but
size "codes"-- are subject to some interpretation on the target system.
That is to say, a paragraph sent in 14 point might render as 12 point on one
platform and 16 point on another. That's the breaks, and probably
acceptable to most people.

Thanks,

Henry
 
D

Diane Ross

I think that should read "...is, in theory, what the recipient will see, but
often will not." Correct?

Correct. The caveat that this can change depending on environment of mac or
pc.

If your problem user does not understand by now, I don't believe there is
anything that will persuade her. Keep sending her plain text and she will
either get the message or not. Evidently she's so enamored with her fancy
text she doesn't care a wit about content or her receivers ability to read.
I would kill file her mail, but that's just me.

--
Diane Ross, Microsoft Mac MVP
Entourage Help Page
<http://www.entourage.mvps.org/>
One of the top five MS Entourage resources listed on the Entourage Blog.
<http://blogs.msdn.com/entourage/>
 
H

henryn

Diane Ross:

Thanks for your response:

Correct. The caveat that this can change depending on environment of mac or
pc.

If your problem user does not understand by now, I don't believe there is
anything that will persuade her. Keep sending her plain text and she will
either get the message or not. Evidently she's so enamored with her fancy
text she doesn't care a wit about content or her receivers ability to read.
I would kill file her mail, but that's just me.

Thank you for your unique solution to this issue. I think we've taken this
just about as far as it can go.

Thanks again,

Henry


[email protected] remove 'zzz'
 
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