Must close all Office X programs to switch Entourage identity

M

Michelle Finocchi

Hello,

Is there any way to change the settings so I don't have to close all Office
programs in order to switch identities in Entourage? I am using Office X.

Thanks,

Michelle
 
C

Corentin Cras-Méneur

Michelle Finocchi said:
Hello,

Is there any way to change the settings so I don't have to close all Office

The reason why you have to close the other Office apps is because
Entourage data (projects, address book etc) integrate in the other
Office apps. If you swotch identity, the other apps have to also change
the shared data according to the new identity.
I doubt that you could switch without closeing the other Office apps.
Maybe if you disable Office Notifications... but I'm not sure (I should
say probably not).

Corentin
 
P

Paul Berkowitz

The reason why you have to close the other Office apps is because
Entourage data (projects, address book etc) integrate in the other
Office apps. If you swotch identity, the other apps have to also change
the shared data according to the new identity.
I doubt that you could switch without closeing the other Office apps.
Maybe if you disable Office Notifications... but I'm not sure (I should
say probably not).

It's not possible. You _must_ close the other apps. as Corentin says, the
Contacts Toolbar, Office Address Book in Tools and for Data Merge, auto
entries that know contacts, all in Word, all refer to the contacts in the
Entourage Address Book of the current identity. If you're switching
identities, you need to close Word so it can re-register the address book
for the new identity. Even the other apps (Excel, PPT) depend on the current
Entourage identity for the Summary in File/Properties of every document, and
maybe more.

--
Paul Berkowitz
MVP MacOffice
Entourage FAQ Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org/faq/index.html>
AppleScripts for Entourage: <http://macscripter.net/scriptbuilders/>

Please "Reply To Newsgroup" to reply to this message. Emails will be
ignored.

PLEASE always state which version of Microsoft Office you are using -
**2004**, X or 2001. It's often impossible to answer your questions
otherwise.
 
M

mmmmark

Is there any possibility (realistically) that they may revist this issue and
make it an "option" to allow this?
 
M

matt neuburg

mmmmark said:
Is there any possibility (realistically) that they may revist this issue and
make it an "option" to allow this?

If you're desperate, make a new Mac OS X user and take advantage of Mac
OS X's Fast User Switching. Your new user's Office identity will be
totally separate from your current user's identity. m.
 
C

Corentin Cras-Méneur

matt neuburg said:
If you're desperate, make a new Mac OS X user and take advantage of Mac
OS X's Fast User Switching. Your new user's Office identity will be
totally separate from your current user's identity. m.


That's DEFINITIVELY the best option IMVHO.

Corentin
 
M

mmmmark

While I realize that WOULD work, it seems silly to have to go to such
lengths for a user to change comprehensively the way that he works.

I have work and personal as separate identities for various reasons and it
certainly is time consuming and frustrating to have to close apps to switch
identities.

A simple preference checkbox to "not use autocomplete for addresses, etc" in
Office apps other than Entourage would be simple to implement and solve the
problem. At least empower the customer to decide if they want that useless
integration.

I guess I'm asking too much. After all, it isn't about what the customer
wants, it's about what Microsoft THINKS the customer should want. <eyeroll>
 
P

Paul Berkowitz

While I realize that WOULD work, it seems silly to have to go to such
lengths for a user to change comprehensively the way that he works.

I have work and personal as separate identities for various reasons and it
certainly is time consuming and frustrating to have to close apps to switch
identities.

A simple preference checkbox to "not use autocomplete for addresses, etc" in
Office apps other than Entourage would be simple to implement and solve the
problem. At least empower the customer to decide if they want that useless
integration.

I guess I'm asking too much. After all, it isn't about what the customer
wants, it's about what Microsoft THINKS the customer should want. <eyeroll>

No it isn't. It's to prevent the user from totally screwing up Office,
corrupting databases, crashing all the apps, and then blaming Microsoft.
<eyeroll>

For every one person who took the option and knew what they were doing,
there would be 100 who took the option to save the trouble when switching
identities, and then didn't understand why Mail Merge didn't work. The very
fact that you call it "useless integration" demonstrates that you don't know
too much about how Office is used in the real world. You can have no idea
how much flak there was in these newsgroups when Office 2001 was released
with Mail Merge (Data Merge in Word) in an unfinished state without the
ability to filter on categories. It was the single greatest complaint for
Office Mac. having got it working properly in Office X and 2004, MacBU is
not going to shoot themselves - and the large number of users who depend on
this feature - in the foot, just to save you a bit of trouble in switching
identities. I expect that they've done their homework and discovered that
there are far more Office users depending on Mail Merge and other
inter-Office reliance on contacts than users who have more than one
Entourage identity. If it were the other way around, I expect they'd do it
your way. Very few people have more than one Entourage identity.

I already pointed out that Word, Excel, and PowerPoint also have the user's
name and company built into File/Properties. Again, this is probably
something you personally don't care about, but a lot of people and
companies, on both Mac and Windows, depend on those being in place when
exchanging documents. That, too, would have to go.

Maybe some day, they'll invent "Fast Identity Switching" to let you open
more than one identity and have Word, Excel, PPT switch along with
Entourage. That would be nice, but would probably be pretty complicated to
implement. If I'm wrong and lots of people would like this, you should all
request it via Help/Send Feedback. If enough people would like this, it
would raise the priority for implementation over things that are now
considered more important for the developer and tester man-hours involved.

In the meantime, doing what Matt and Corentin suggest will let you do it.
Fast user switching is really easy. To start you off, just copy your "Office
2004 Identities" subfolder of the Microsoft User Data folder to
/Users/Shared User/ and then to the MUD folder of a new OS X user (after
launching and quitting Entourage there once). That will replicate your two
(or more) identities to the other Os X user. Switch to the user you want
there. You can then delete your regular identity there, if you want, and the
alternate one here (main user) if you want. Or not. It's your option. (Nice
of Apple and Microsoft to allow you that option, no? <Eyeroll>)

--
Paul Berkowitz
MVP MacOffice
Entourage FAQ Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org/faq/index.html>
AppleScripts for Entourage: <http://macscripter.net/scriptbuilders/>

Please "Reply To Newsgroup" to reply to this message. Emails will be
ignored.

PLEASE always state which version of Microsoft Office you are using -
**2004**, X or 2001. It's often impossible to answer your questions
otherwise.
 
M

mmmmark

No it isn't. It's to prevent the user from totally screwing up Office,
corrupting databases, crashing all the apps, and then blaming Microsoft.
<eyeroll>

For every one person who took the option and knew what they were doing,
there would be 100 who took the option to save the trouble when switching
identities, and then didn't understand why Mail Merge didn't work. The very
fact that you call it "useless integration" demonstrates that you don't know
too much about how Office is used in the real world. You can have no idea
how much flak there was in these newsgroups when Office 2001 was released
with Mail Merge (Data Merge in Word) in an unfinished state without the
ability to filter on categories. It was the single greatest complaint for
Office Mac. having got it working properly in Office X and 2004, MacBU is
not going to shoot themselves - and the large number of users who depend on
this feature - in the foot, just to save you a bit of trouble in switching
identities. I expect that they've done their homework and discovered that
there are far more Office users depending on Mail Merge and other
inter-Office reliance on contacts than users who have more than one
Entourage identity. If it were the other way around, I expect they'd do it
your way. Very few people have more than one Entourage identity.

A VERY small minority of people I know even know HOW to use mail merge.
While I can and have used it, it is not a function that I do regularly.

If the MacBU can't find a better way to utilize separate identities, they
shouldn't even include them--but instead require separate logins in OS X for
each identity.
I already pointed out that Word, Excel, and PowerPoint also have the user's
name and company built into File/Properties. Again, this is probably
something you personally don't care about, but a lot of people and
companies, on both Mac and Windows, depend on those being in place when
exchanging documents. That, too, would have to go.

I do care about this and use the information in these fields extensively.
Usually, I open up the properties and add extensive additional information.
Maybe some day, they'll invent "Fast Identity Switching" to let you open
more than one identity and have Word, Excel, PPT switch along with
Entourage. That would be nice, but would probably be pretty complicated to
implement. If I'm wrong and lots of people would like this, you should all
request it via Help/Send Feedback. If enough people would like this, it
would raise the priority for implementation over things that are now
considered more important for the developer and tester man-hours involved.

The way it makes sense to me, is that the identity that is active when you
OPEN a document goes into the properties field. I do realize that this
would probably confuse many people and is a bit more complex. The way you
describe it is basically what I have in mind. I'm not positive, but I
believe this is how Outlook Express worked on the PC side for years. I
don't think it asked you to close docs when you switched identities.
 
M

matt neuburg

mmmmark said:
If the MacBU can't find a better way to utilize separate identities,
they shouldn't even include them--but instead require separate logins in
OS X for each identity.

Undoubtedly the Identities feature has the air of something that
preceded the days of, and now has some trouble fitting in with,
Unix-style system-level multiple users. Also the notion of Office as
interconnected apps is somewhat troublesome. But whining isn't going to
help; you've been presented with explanations of why things are this
way, along with various options, so I suggest you face reality and take
one of them or use a different email client. m.
 
M

mmmmark

<-----feeling sufficiently chastised, mmmmark shamefully slithers back into
his cave to gingerly lick his wounds of contempt. Before collapsing in
exasperation, he almost unintelligibly murmurs something under his breath
about the blood pact he unwittingly signed with the beast from the pacific
northwest. ;-)
 
C

Corentin Cras-Méneur

mmmmark said:
<-----feeling sufficiently chastised, mmmmark shamefully slithers back into
his cave to gingerly lick his wounds of contempt. Before collapsing in
exasperation, he almost unintelligibly murmurs something under his breath
about the blood pact he unwittingly signed with the beast from the pacific
northwest. ;-)


LOL!!!!! :-D
Yeah I think the feature indeed goes back to the MacOS 8/9 times where
multi user on MacOS was at its begining. I didn't like it in MacOS 9 and
I don't like multi personality support in ENtourage today.
Around here some people tend to use Mac the old fashin way having only
one user account on the Mac with 4-5 people accessing the same computer
and using it to check e-mails, work etc. This is a disaster about to
happen (of course they erase oother people's files by mistake, complain
that everybody can read their e-mails etc).

I'm a strong advocate of the : "one user - one account" policy.
I therefore also like the "one identity:eek:ne user account" system,
especially since Fast User Switching really makes it fast and easy to go
back and forth between accounts.
....my 2 eurocents ;-)

Corentin
 
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