Beta 2007 -Toolbar next to Menu toolbar?

[OneDave]

I am trying to customize my ON toolbars to maximize available screen turf on
my tablet. When I drag a toolbar to be beside the Menu toolbar, the Menu tool
bar jumps down or up so as to stay on its own line. Space on the Menu toolbar
line is left unoccupied (i.e., wasted).

 

[Patrick Schmid]

Menubars and toolbars can't share the same row as far as I know.
Have you seen the maximize feature? It's the button to the right of
help.

Patrick Schmid

 

[OneDave]

Thanks anyhow. As displays get smaller, I hope designers will consider the
'price' of space they put things in...
--
Thanks
Dave

Menubars and toolbars can't share the same row as far as I know.
Have you seen the maximize feature? It's the button to the right of
help.

Patrick Schmid

 

[Patrick Schmid]

That's why there is the maximize/full screen mode.
The next version of ON after 2007 will probably get the ribbon.

Patrick Schmid
--------------
http://pschmid.net

Thanks anyhow. As displays get smaller, I hope designers will consider the
'price' of space they put things in...

 

[Rainald Taesler]

Patrick Schmid shared these words of wisdom:

Menubars and toolbars can't share the same row as far as I know.

Yes. Unfortunately!
It can be done in quite a number of applications, f.e. in the Internet
Explorer and Outlook Express.
That Office applications (Office 2003, have not tested anything of
2007 except ON) do not allow this, IMO is a true shortcoming. Valuable
screen real estate is gained the way I have set up my IE.

Have you seen the maximize feature? It's the button to the right
of help.

You mean the "Full page view"?
As an aside: Most crazy thing I've ever seen to use a "$" sign as icon
for this feature ...

This is not of help at all in so far as it only removes *parts* the
"Standard" toolbar - crazy enough <!!> - but not totally (the not
selectable "Today" item with the red flag stays behind greyed <!>) and
leaves behind the rest of the toolbars.

This feature would be a thing of its own if it comes to design flaws.
It hides the necessary navigation tools including the necessary
navigation means incl. the green "back" and "forward" icons <!>,
printing and other items of first rank (being the standard parts of
the "Standard" toolbar) but leaves behind any of the other toolbars as
well as all of the *selectable* stuff in the "Standard" toolbar and
even a not selectable item of the latter.
Would need most urgent care IMO.

Rainald

 

[Rainald Taesler]

OneDave shared these words of wisdom:

Thanks anyhow. As displays get smaller, I hope designers will
consider the 'price' of space they put things in...

Actually screens are not getting smaller - the in general movement
goes into the "CimaScope" direction <g>.
Only some types of computers are working with a limit of 1024
resolution.
And on a tablet in portrait mode screen real estate is of high
importance.
Usage of the free area in the area of the menu bar (as is possible
with f.e. IE) counts.

Rainald

 

[Patrick Schmid]

You mean the "Full page view"?

As an aside: Most crazy thing I've ever seen to use a "$" sign as icon
for this feature ...

Something is wrong on your end. It has a rather nice icon that fits, not
the $ sign.

This is not of help at all in so far as it only removes *parts* the
"Standard" toolbar - crazy enough <!!> - but not totally (the not
selectable "Today" item with the red flag stays behind greyed <!>) and
leaves behind the rest of the toolbars.


This feature would be a thing of its own if it comes to design flaws.
It hides the necessary navigation tools including the necessary
navigation means incl. the green "back" and "forward" icons <!>,
printing and other items of first rank (being the standard parts of
the "Standard" toolbar) but leaves behind any of the other toolbars as
well as all of the *selectable* stuff in the "Standard" toolbar and
even a not selectable item of the latter.
Would need most urgent care IMO.

No, the idea is to give you one full page on your screen for reading,
annotating, taking notes etc. Hence no navigation tools, but the other
tools you need to use with notes.

Patrick Schmid

 

[Rainald Taesler]

Patrick Schmid shared these words of wisdom:

Something is wrong on your end. It has a rather nice icon that fits,
not the $ sign.

An icon?
In the menu bar?
Would not be too much consistent with the in general design and
keeping to GUI guidelines <g&d>.
Do other Office 2007 have icons in the MenuBar too?

Yes, on my machines it's a "$" when in normal state, only changes to
an
icon when activated. The "$" seems to be an icon as it has a
"SpeedTip".
May I mail you a clipping from this part of the screen?

No, the idea is to give you one full page on your screen for
reading, annotating, taking notes etc. Hence no navigation tools,
but the other tools you need to use with notes.

This is understandable (although I think that a real "full screen"
mode
should be available).
It does not at all work as you have it mind and as you describe
it, however.

Would clippings be of help to understand which deficiencies I'm
talking
about?

Rainald

 

[Patrick Schmid]

Before you email me clippings, you might want to remove and reinstall ON
2007. Maybe there is more broken than just the icon?

Patrick Schmid

 

[Rainald Taesler]

Patrick Schmid shared these words of wisdom:

Before you email me clippings, you might want to remove and
reinstall ON 2007. Maybe there is more broken than just the icon?

Sorry, Patrick, should you feel any offense by my suggestion to send
you clippings showing what's wrong (unfortunately - for very good
reason, however - this is not allowed in here).
I did suggest this only in order to provide you with some insight on
what is going on at least on my system.

No need - definitely NOT <!!> - for re-installing!
(Wish I could solve the still ongoing problem with the installation on
my TabletPC [a longer thread, no help form your side, things as bad as
they were befoer, even after three re-installs], so you might
understand that this makes angry).

It's just the very *SAME* on both my machines (desktop as well as
TabletPC).
So this should be sufficient. Shouldn't it?

Rainald
P.S. By the time I'm beginning to feel that you just won't take me
serious.
Goddam, in the last 2 weeks I obviously have spent more time than
anyone else on this ON Beta. And I do not like it at all to see that
what I'm posting in best faith (and after serious experimenting) is
just questioned without any reasons ...

 

[Patrick Schmid]

P.S. By the time I'm beginning to feel that you just won't take me

serious.
Goddam, in the last 2 weeks I obviously have spent more time than
anyone else on this ON Beta. And I do not like it at all to see that
what I'm posting in best faith (and after serious experimenting) is
just questioned without any reasons ...

I think you took my reply the completely wrong way. The only reason why
I would need to see a clipping is if I didn't believe you. As I believe
you though completely that you don't have the icon, there is no need for
me to look at a clipping. I do take you seriously, which is why I don't
need to see a clipping.
My best guess is that the icon wasn't installed correctly, which I why I
suggested removing and reinstalling. If that doesn't fix it, then it's a
bug and you should submit one via Connect.
Honestly, there is no need for me to see a clipping. As I said before,
only if I didn't believe you would I ask for a clipping. When you submit
the issue on Connect, I'd attach a clipping. Clippings help MS whenever
it comes to visual issues.

Patrick Schmid[/QUOTE]

 

[Kathy Jacobs]

Can I offer a suggestion? Since you are seeing this on both machines, it
might be worth sending a frown in. Frowns go directly to the dev group (I
know that for OneNote the Connect bugs do too), but with the addition of an
automatic screen shot with a note.

If you haven't yet installed Send a Smile/Send a Frown, check out this link:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...E2-BC0F-4403-B09F-7A677D55F274&displaylang=en

Second note: I have a TC-1000 which I have replaced with a Lenovo. Part of
the reason that I replaced it was because the TC-1000 was going to be way
underpowered for OneNote 2007 (and Office 2007 in general). It might be
worth taking the time to sit down and compare the performance on the desktop
vs. the TC-1000. Some of your other problems on the TC-1000 might be
performance related. I am not saying the icon is performance related - that
sounds like an oops somewhere. I am saying that some of your other problems
might just be because of the tablet you are using.

My two cents, take it or leave it....

--
Kathryn Jacobs, Microsoft MVP PowerPoint and OneNote
Author of Kathy Jacobs on PowerPoint - Available now from Holy Macro! Books
Get PowerPoint and OneNote information at www.onppt.com

I believe life is meant to be lived. But:
if we live without making a difference, it makes no difference that we lived

Patrick Schmid shared these words of wisdom:

Before you email me clippings, you might want to remove and
reinstall ON 2007. Maybe there is more broken than just the icon?

Sorry, Patrick, should you feel any offense by my suggestion to send you
clippings showing what's wrong (unfortunately - for very good reason,
however - this is not allowed in here).
I did suggest this only in order to provide you with some insight on what
is going on at least on my system.

No need - definitely NOT <!!> - for re-installing!
(Wish I could solve the still ongoing problem with the installation on my
TabletPC [a longer thread, no help form your side, things as bad as they
were befoer, even after three re-installs], so you might understand that
this makes angry).

It's just the very *SAME* on both my machines (desktop as well as
TabletPC).
So this should be sufficient. Shouldn't it?

Rainald
P.S. By the time I'm beginning to feel that you just won't take me
serious.
Goddam, in the last 2 weeks I obviously have spent more time than anyone
else on this ON Beta. And I do not like it at all to see that what I'm
posting in best faith (and after serious experimenting) is just questioned
without any reasons ...

 

[Patrick Schmid]

Hi Kathy,

Just an FYI: For OneNote 2007 (and ON only), users can send feedback via
Connect in addition to the send a smile tool. For ON 2007, Connect is
the preferred method for reporting issues.

Patrick Schmid
--------------
http://pschmid.net

Can I offer a suggestion? Since you are seeing this on both machines, it
might be worth sending a frown in. Frowns go directly to the dev group (I
know that for OneNote the Connect bugs do too), but with the addition of an
automatic screen shot with a note.

If you haven't yet installed Send a Smile/Send a Frown, check out this link:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...E2-BC0F-4403-B09F-7A677D55F274&displaylang=en

Second note: I have a TC-1000 which I have replaced with a Lenovo. Part of
the reason that I replaced it was because the TC-1000 was going to be way
underpowered for OneNote 2007 (and Office 2007 in general). It might be
worth taking the time to sit down and compare the performance on the desktop
vs. the TC-1000. Some of your other problems on the TC-1000 might be
performance related. I am not saying the icon is performance related - that
sounds like an oops somewhere. I am saying that some of your other problems
might just be because of the tablet you are using.

My two cents, take it or leave it....

--
Kathryn Jacobs, Microsoft MVP PowerPoint and OneNote
Author of Kathy Jacobs on PowerPoint - Available now from Holy Macro! Books
Get PowerPoint and OneNote information at www.onppt.com

I believe life is meant to be lived. But:
if we live without making a difference, it makes no difference that we lived

Patrick Schmid shared these words of wisdom:

Before you email me clippings, you might want to remove and
reinstall ON 2007. Maybe there is more broken than just the icon?

Sorry, Patrick, should you feel any offense by my suggestion to send you
clippings showing what's wrong (unfortunately - for very good reason,
however - this is not allowed in here).
I did suggest this only in order to provide you with some insight on what
is going on at least on my system.

No need - definitely NOT <!!> - for re-installing!
(Wish I could solve the still ongoing problem with the installation on my
TabletPC [a longer thread, no help form your side, things as bad as they
were befoer, even after three re-installs], so you might understand that
this makes angry).

It's just the very *SAME* on both my machines (desktop as well as
TabletPC).
So this should be sufficient. Shouldn't it?

Rainald
P.S. By the time I'm beginning to feel that you just won't take me
serious.
Goddam, in the last 2 weeks I obviously have spent more time than anyone
else on this ON Beta. And I do not like it at all to see that what I'm
posting in best faith (and after serious experimenting) is just questioned
without any reasons ...

Patrick Schmid shared these words of wisdom:

You mean the "Full page view"?
As an aside: Most crazy thing I've ever seen to use a "$"
sign as icon
for this feature ...

Something is wrong on your end. It has a rather nice icon that
fits, not the $ sign.

An icon?
In the menu bar?
Would not be too much consistent with the in general design and
keeping to GUI guidelines <g&d>.
Do other Office 2007 have icons in the MenuBar too?

Yes, on my machines it's a "$" when in normal state, only
changes to an
icon when activated. The "$" seems to be an icon as it has a
"SpeedTip".
May I mail you a clipping from this part of the screen?

This is not of help at all in so far as it only removes parts
of the "Standard" toolbar - crazy enough <!!> - but not
totally (the not selectable "Today" item with the red flag
stays behind greyed <!>) and leaves behind the rest of the
toolbars. This feature would be a thing of its own if it comes to
design
flaws.
It hides the necessary navigation tools including the
necessary navigation means incl. the green "back" and
"forward" icons <!>, printing and other items of first rank
(being the standard parts of the "Standard" toolbar) but
leaves behind any of the other toolbars as well as all of the
selectable stuff in the "Standard" toolbar and even a not
selectable item of the latter. Would need most urgent care IMO.

No, the idea is to give you one full page on your screen for
reading, annotating, taking notes etc. Hence no navigation
tools, but the other tools you need to use with notes.

This is understandable (although I think that a real "full
screen" mode
should be available).
It does not at all work as you have it mind and as you describe
it, however.

Would clippings be of help to understand which deficiencies I'm
talking
about?

Rainald

 

[Rainald Taesler]

Tanks for sharing your thoughts, Kathy.

Can I offer a suggestion? Since you are seeing this on both
machines, it might be worth sending a frown in. Frowns go directly
to the dev group (I know that for OneNote the Connect bugs do too),
but with the addition of an automatic screen shot with a note.

If you haven't yet installed Send a Smile/Send a Frown, check out
this link:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...E2-BC0F-4403-B09F-7A677D55F274&displaylang=en

Thanks for the suggestion, Kathy.
I installed that.
But as far as anomalies in ON 2007 I'll follow Patrick's advice to
file a bug via Connect.
As the icon is not the only problem with the "full screen view" it may
take me some time to put things together.

Second note: I have a TC-1000 which I have replaced with a Lenovo.

This was no choice for me because of the budget.
OTH the construction with the detachable keyboard was a factor in
decision making quite a while ago.
I wanted to have a device as portable as possible for carrying it
around for the main task of running the presnetations for my lectures.
I had also thought on getting an "OQO"
http://www.oqo.com/
but it did exceed the budget too (would have cost almost twice as much
as I finally paid for my tc1100)and I was not really sure that it
would not be too exotic.
What I'm most excited about is the "cPC" from Dualcor
http://www.dualcor.com/

Part of the reason that I replaced it was because the
TC-1000 was going to be way underpowered for
OneNote 2007 (and Office 2007 in general).

The tc1100 I have is different from your tc1000 which did have a
Transmeta CPU. I knew that the Centrino M 1.1Ghz is not too fast
(having used a 1.0Ghz notebook before) but it now has 1.5GB RAM and it
works fine for what I'm using it. The initial decision of COMPAQ to
build the tc1000 with this processor was a seriously wrong decision
and for the second model the made the move to Intel. I did not test it
scientifically that the tc1000 behaves a lot better than my friend's
tc1000.

It could well be that it is well below what's needed for Vista and
Office 2007 but should I have done? Buy a another midrange notebook?

So far I am not seeing any shortcomings with ON 2007.
ON opens a bit faster on my 2.8Ghz desktop, but that's it.

It might be worth taking the time to sit down and compare the
performance on the desktop vs. the TC-1000. Some of your other
problems on the TC-1000 might be performance related. I am not
saying the icon is performance related - that sounds like an oops
somewhere. I am saying that some of your other problems might just
be because of the tablet you are using.

The only "problems" I have is the WDS 3 beta.
I could not find a way to get rid of the warning message box that WDS
was not properly installed. And can not see any connecting to the fact
that the CPU is only a 1.1Ghz Intel.

Thanks again
Rainald
P.S. meanwhile your book has arrived but I did not yet find the time
to do more than just a short look through it. From what I saw, I'm
sure that I'll like it. No comparison to the dumb thing I had bought
over here ...

 

[Rainald Taesler]

Patrick,
I'm so sad about the big misunderstanding.
Seems there just was a bit too much of frustartion.

Pls accept my apologies.

Rainald

Patrick Schmid shared these words of wisdom:

 

[Patrick Schmid]

Rainald,

Misunderstandings can happen. No big deal at all.

Patrick