Breaking a Large Schedule Into Small Sub-Projects

S

Sinister

I am trying to break apart a very large schedule into smaller sub-projects,
but I'm finding out just how difficult that can be. I need to move tasks to a
new file without losing the links to tasks that will be moved into yet
another file. Is this possible or am I looking at having to re-link
everything again once I've broken the schedule apart?

Thanks,
Patrick
 
J

Jim Aksel

Sorry, but it will be a manual process.
One thing that may help will be to cut/paste all your tasks to the
appropriate new files. Then open all the files. Click Window/New Window...
Select all the Project files and click OK.

You now have a new Master Project File that will contain all the subordinate
files as subproject. You can link in the usual manner by selecting the two
tasks.

Caution: We always keep the Master and all the subordinate files in the same
folder. Under no circumstances should you copy/paste or drag an individual
file out of that folder. Also, using Save As... will cause grave problems
with the linking.

The best way to explain it, is you have to consider that the entire folder
is your schedule. If you want to copy something to/from a location, you need
to copy the entire folder. If you do it that way, when you open Master.mpp
you maintain the integrity of the links witihin the folder.
--
If this post was helpful, please consider rating it.

Jim

Check out my new blog for more information:
http://www.msprojectblog.com
 
D

DavidC

Hi Jim,

Excuse my breaking in to your response, but this is an issue I have been
struggling with over the past 18 months.

Background:

The project is a construction project which starts with our schedule
predicting the full project timeframe. Then when the contract is let we have
effecively two other schedules for the construction, and these are linked
together and into my overall schedule, later another three contractors are
engaged by the main contractor, and their schedules are then integrated into
the contractor's overall schedule. At this stage we now have my schedule,
with the contractor's schedule integrated into mine, and the contractor's
schedule having four schedules from their contractors integrated in. I then
have a further two contractor schedules which need to be integrated into mine
and some links between the other contractor schedules. This rather
convaluted contract arrangement is simply the nature of the construction work
and the split in the scope that has been made. It does actually make sense.

The issue is, as you alluded to, that these master/submaster projects are
thwart with dangers from spurious links being created when individuasl
schedules are moved. Problem is that each contractor needs their own
schedule to update and manage and not necessarily see the other schedules.
Often issues of IP and confidentiality impact on what can be viewed.

I am therefore trying to find a solution which enables me to have a full
schedule for the project that each contractor can manage independantly but
does not leave old external link refereneces. My thought is simply to have
the updates completed on a central server that everyone can access and limit
the read options, and then each contractor can save their own copy outside
the server in their own system if they wish. They then amy have issues with
external links left in the schedule impacting on how their schedule then
reflects progress.


I am sorry to impose like this but often two or more heads are better than
one, and it is easy to get fixed on one course of action.

Many thanks

DavidC
 
J

Jim Aksel

I do the same situation every month. It is tedious.

We maintain a single master.mpp with external predecessors. Each month my
subcontractor submits their monthly schedule (without the links to the
master). That is, my sub has no clue that I integrate into a master file and
use their file to drive my dates. The key is to keep all the file names the
same. Master is always Master.mpp and my sub is always SubProject.mpp. So
when my sub submits a new file I use the file compare utility (gulp -- it
does have its quirks). Once I am satisfied that the new file submitted is an
accurate reflection of their progress, I overwrite the old SubProject.mpp
file with the new one. Since the file names stay the same, when I open
Master.mpp it is happy to look for the external links in the same location.
Again, my SubProject.mpp has no external sucessors and is not driven by
Master.mpp. It only flows one way. Of course we keep appropriate monthly
archives.

It appears you may be able to do something similar.

Another approach is to have a section at the top of each file called Givers
and Receivers. Givers are the ONLY exit from the file. A giver must have an
internal file predecessor and an external successor to a differnt file.
Receivers are the opposite. A Receiver must have external predecessors and
must drive one or more internal successors. The ONLY place an external
predecessor may enter the file is at the point of a receiver.

But you may get more complicated than that because of your file depth. In
cases like yours, I establish a unique number scheme in every file and store
it in a text field. To keep it simple let's just call every file with a
letter name: A, B. C... I then create a formula in every file in a text
field. The formula for file "A.mpp" is: "A"+[Unique ID]. For file "G.mpp"
the formula would be "G"+[Unique ID]

Then, I use either another text field or the Notes area for each giver and
receiver. If I am in File "B" and I have a receiver from file "D" then I put
the link number in to the notes. In file "B" as a note I may say "D123"
which means the true predecessor is in FIle D.mpp and is UNIQUE ID 123. Why
use Unique ID? You will see the Unique IDs actually shift when you move to a
master file, so I invented the Text field formula technique, the formula
value remains constant. Also, Task IDs can change but a Unique ID never
will. Suppose a sub adds tasks above your link?

What this does is give you a method to find the real cross references on a
manual basis. Trust me, you will need it.

Implementation: Mandate that all suppliers may not delete these type of
tasks (if I delete a task and re-enter it, the Unique ID changes ... oops!).
You have to get them to commit to the formula scenario.

Needless to say, it requires some thought. We maintain a spreadsheet of
Giver/Receivers under configuration control. No one is allowed to change the
date of a giver or receiver without going to the Configuration Control Board
for permission. This is how we coordinate impacts since file owners can be
separated by continents (like England and the USA). If you need some
additional help, you can eventually dig out my contact information from the
blog if you poke around.

Not to give away my trade secrets, but you can make up your own numbering
scheme on the A123 type things. You may want to tie it to a WBS, a phase of
the contract, etc. Configuation control is your key. You are verging on
using Project Server to control all this along with some access rights. The
problem is going to be an IT issue with getting your subs through your
firewall to update their files. We have found CITRIX is a useful tool for
this scenario as well.
--
If this post was helpful, please consider rating it.

Jim

Check out my new blog for more information:
http://www.msprojectblog.com
 
D

DavidC

Hi Jim,

Thanks for your reply. Certainly I have found that trap whereby the external
links are based on the activity ID and not the UID. We have aslo tried
having all the external links set at the top of the schedule, but still come
foul of these being added to periodically and the links referencing and old
ID. I also tried manually entering the UID link into a custom field but this
also became quite tedious.

However you have given me hope and some thoughts to progress, given that I
am at the end of one project with another just started and more starting over
the next five to ten years a good solution will be great.

I can see the benefits in having only one external link and the sub projects
essentially being stand alone since they will not retain links and
artificially driving their dates inappropriately.

I really appreciate your thoughts as firstly it has provided me some other
ideas, and secondly you have in effect confirmed our own thoughts and file
configuration.

Many regards

DavidC
Jim Aksel said:
I do the same situation every month. It is tedious.

We maintain a single master.mpp with external predecessors. Each month my
subcontractor submits their monthly schedule (without the links to the
master). That is, my sub has no clue that I integrate into a master file and
use their file to drive my dates. The key is to keep all the file names the
same. Master is always Master.mpp and my sub is always SubProject.mpp. So
when my sub submits a new file I use the file compare utility (gulp -- it
does have its quirks). Once I am satisfied that the new file submitted is an
accurate reflection of their progress, I overwrite the old SubProject.mpp
file with the new one. Since the file names stay the same, when I open
Master.mpp it is happy to look for the external links in the same location.
Again, my SubProject.mpp has no external sucessors and is not driven by
Master.mpp. It only flows one way. Of course we keep appropriate monthly
archives.

It appears you may be able to do something similar.

Another approach is to have a section at the top of each file called Givers
and Receivers. Givers are the ONLY exit from the file. A giver must have an
internal file predecessor and an external successor to a differnt file.
Receivers are the opposite. A Receiver must have external predecessors and
must drive one or more internal successors. The ONLY place an external
predecessor may enter the file is at the point of a receiver.

But you may get more complicated than that because of your file depth. In
cases like yours, I establish a unique number scheme in every file and store
it in a text field. To keep it simple let's just call every file with a
letter name: A, B. C... I then create a formula in every file in a text
field. The formula for file "A.mpp" is: "A"+[Unique ID]. For file "G.mpp"
the formula would be "G"+[Unique ID]

Then, I use either another text field or the Notes area for each giver and
receiver. If I am in File "B" and I have a receiver from file "D" then I put
the link number in to the notes. In file "B" as a note I may say "D123"
which means the true predecessor is in FIle D.mpp and is UNIQUE ID 123. Why
use Unique ID? You will see the Unique IDs actually shift when you move to a
master file, so I invented the Text field formula technique, the formula
value remains constant. Also, Task IDs can change but a Unique ID never
will. Suppose a sub adds tasks above your link?

What this does is give you a method to find the real cross references on a
manual basis. Trust me, you will need it.

Implementation: Mandate that all suppliers may not delete these type of
tasks (if I delete a task and re-enter it, the Unique ID changes ... oops!).
You have to get them to commit to the formula scenario.

Needless to say, it requires some thought. We maintain a spreadsheet of
Giver/Receivers under configuration control. No one is allowed to change the
date of a giver or receiver without going to the Configuration Control Board
for permission. This is how we coordinate impacts since file owners can be
separated by continents (like England and the USA). If you need some
additional help, you can eventually dig out my contact information from the
blog if you poke around.

Not to give away my trade secrets, but you can make up your own numbering
scheme on the A123 type things. You may want to tie it to a WBS, a phase of
the contract, etc. Configuation control is your key. You are verging on
using Project Server to control all this along with some access rights. The
problem is going to be an IT issue with getting your subs through your
firewall to update their files. We have found CITRIX is a useful tool for
this scenario as well.
--
If this post was helpful, please consider rating it.

Jim

Check out my new blog for more information:
http://www.msprojectblog.com



DavidC said:
Hi Jim,

Excuse my breaking in to your response, but this is an issue I have been
struggling with over the past 18 months.

Background:

The project is a construction project which starts with our schedule
predicting the full project timeframe. Then when the contract is let we have
effecively two other schedules for the construction, and these are linked
together and into my overall schedule, later another three contractors are
engaged by the main contractor, and their schedules are then integrated into
the contractor's overall schedule. At this stage we now have my schedule,
with the contractor's schedule integrated into mine, and the contractor's
schedule having four schedules from their contractors integrated in. I then
have a further two contractor schedules which need to be integrated into mine
and some links between the other contractor schedules. This rather
convaluted contract arrangement is simply the nature of the construction work
and the split in the scope that has been made. It does actually make sense.

The issue is, as you alluded to, that these master/submaster projects are
thwart with dangers from spurious links being created when individuasl
schedules are moved. Problem is that each contractor needs their own
schedule to update and manage and not necessarily see the other schedules.
Often issues of IP and confidentiality impact on what can be viewed.

I am therefore trying to find a solution which enables me to have a full
schedule for the project that each contractor can manage independantly but
does not leave old external link refereneces. My thought is simply to have
the updates completed on a central server that everyone can access and limit
the read options, and then each contractor can save their own copy outside
the server in their own system if they wish. They then amy have issues with
external links left in the schedule impacting on how their schedule then
reflects progress.


I am sorry to impose like this but often two or more heads are better than
one, and it is easy to get fixed on one course of action.

Many thanks

DavidC
 
J

Jim Aksel

Happy to help and thank you for the feedback.
--
If this post was helpful, please consider rating it.

Jim

Check out my new blog for more information:
http://www.msprojectblog.com



DavidC said:
Hi Jim,

Thanks for your reply. Certainly I have found that trap whereby the external
links are based on the activity ID and not the UID. We have aslo tried
having all the external links set at the top of the schedule, but still come
foul of these being added to periodically and the links referencing and old
ID. I also tried manually entering the UID link into a custom field but this
also became quite tedious.

However you have given me hope and some thoughts to progress, given that I
am at the end of one project with another just started and more starting over
the next five to ten years a good solution will be great.

I can see the benefits in having only one external link and the sub projects
essentially being stand alone since they will not retain links and
artificially driving their dates inappropriately.

I really appreciate your thoughts as firstly it has provided me some other
ideas, and secondly you have in effect confirmed our own thoughts and file
configuration.

Many regards

DavidC
Jim Aksel said:
I do the same situation every month. It is tedious.

We maintain a single master.mpp with external predecessors. Each month my
subcontractor submits their monthly schedule (without the links to the
master). That is, my sub has no clue that I integrate into a master file and
use their file to drive my dates. The key is to keep all the file names the
same. Master is always Master.mpp and my sub is always SubProject.mpp. So
when my sub submits a new file I use the file compare utility (gulp -- it
does have its quirks). Once I am satisfied that the new file submitted is an
accurate reflection of their progress, I overwrite the old SubProject.mpp
file with the new one. Since the file names stay the same, when I open
Master.mpp it is happy to look for the external links in the same location.
Again, my SubProject.mpp has no external sucessors and is not driven by
Master.mpp. It only flows one way. Of course we keep appropriate monthly
archives.

It appears you may be able to do something similar.

Another approach is to have a section at the top of each file called Givers
and Receivers. Givers are the ONLY exit from the file. A giver must have an
internal file predecessor and an external successor to a differnt file.
Receivers are the opposite. A Receiver must have external predecessors and
must drive one or more internal successors. The ONLY place an external
predecessor may enter the file is at the point of a receiver.

But you may get more complicated than that because of your file depth. In
cases like yours, I establish a unique number scheme in every file and store
it in a text field. To keep it simple let's just call every file with a
letter name: A, B. C... I then create a formula in every file in a text
field. The formula for file "A.mpp" is: "A"+[Unique ID]. For file "G.mpp"
the formula would be "G"+[Unique ID]

Then, I use either another text field or the Notes area for each giver and
receiver. If I am in File "B" and I have a receiver from file "D" then I put
the link number in to the notes. In file "B" as a note I may say "D123"
which means the true predecessor is in FIle D.mpp and is UNIQUE ID 123. Why
use Unique ID? You will see the Unique IDs actually shift when you move to a
master file, so I invented the Text field formula technique, the formula
value remains constant. Also, Task IDs can change but a Unique ID never
will. Suppose a sub adds tasks above your link?

What this does is give you a method to find the real cross references on a
manual basis. Trust me, you will need it.

Implementation: Mandate that all suppliers may not delete these type of
tasks (if I delete a task and re-enter it, the Unique ID changes ... oops!).
You have to get them to commit to the formula scenario.

Needless to say, it requires some thought. We maintain a spreadsheet of
Giver/Receivers under configuration control. No one is allowed to change the
date of a giver or receiver without going to the Configuration Control Board
for permission. This is how we coordinate impacts since file owners can be
separated by continents (like England and the USA). If you need some
additional help, you can eventually dig out my contact information from the
blog if you poke around.

Not to give away my trade secrets, but you can make up your own numbering
scheme on the A123 type things. You may want to tie it to a WBS, a phase of
the contract, etc. Configuation control is your key. You are verging on
using Project Server to control all this along with some access rights. The
problem is going to be an IT issue with getting your subs through your
firewall to update their files. We have found CITRIX is a useful tool for
this scenario as well.
--
If this post was helpful, please consider rating it.

Jim

Check out my new blog for more information:
http://www.msprojectblog.com



DavidC said:
Hi Jim,

Excuse my breaking in to your response, but this is an issue I have been
struggling with over the past 18 months.

Background:

The project is a construction project which starts with our schedule
predicting the full project timeframe. Then when the contract is let we have
effecively two other schedules for the construction, and these are linked
together and into my overall schedule, later another three contractors are
engaged by the main contractor, and their schedules are then integrated into
the contractor's overall schedule. At this stage we now have my schedule,
with the contractor's schedule integrated into mine, and the contractor's
schedule having four schedules from their contractors integrated in. I then
have a further two contractor schedules which need to be integrated into mine
and some links between the other contractor schedules. This rather
convaluted contract arrangement is simply the nature of the construction work
and the split in the scope that has been made. It does actually make sense.

The issue is, as you alluded to, that these master/submaster projects are
thwart with dangers from spurious links being created when individuasl
schedules are moved. Problem is that each contractor needs their own
schedule to update and manage and not necessarily see the other schedules.
Often issues of IP and confidentiality impact on what can be viewed.

I am therefore trying to find a solution which enables me to have a full
schedule for the project that each contractor can manage independantly but
does not leave old external link refereneces. My thought is simply to have
the updates completed on a central server that everyone can access and limit
the read options, and then each contractor can save their own copy outside
the server in their own system if they wish. They then amy have issues with
external links left in the schedule impacting on how their schedule then
reflects progress.


I am sorry to impose like this but often two or more heads are better than
one, and it is easy to get fixed on one course of action.

Many thanks

DavidC

:

Sorry, but it will be a manual process.
One thing that may help will be to cut/paste all your tasks to the
appropriate new files. Then open all the files. Click Window/New Window...
Select all the Project files and click OK.

You now have a new Master Project File that will contain all the subordinate
files as subproject. You can link in the usual manner by selecting the two
tasks.

Caution: We always keep the Master and all the subordinate files in the same
folder. Under no circumstances should you copy/paste or drag an individual
file out of that folder. Also, using Save As... will cause grave problems
with the linking.

The best way to explain it, is you have to consider that the entire folder
is your schedule. If you want to copy something to/from a location, you need
to copy the entire folder. If you do it that way, when you open Master.mpp
you maintain the integrity of the links witihin the folder.
--
If this post was helpful, please consider rating it.

Jim

Check out my new blog for more information:
http://www.msprojectblog.com



:

I am trying to break apart a very large schedule into smaller sub-projects,
but I'm finding out just how difficult that can be. I need to move tasks to a
new file without losing the links to tasks that will be moved into yet
another file. Is this possible or am I looking at having to re-link
everything again once I've broken the schedule apart?

Thanks,
Patrick
 

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