Exceptional Error - Custom Menus deleted at startup of Access !

N

Nabeel

Hi,

I had been working with databases from many years...Recently I had
encountered an exceptional/unusual kind of error in Microsoft Access 2000.

I had developed some applications on Microsoft Access 97 and Access 2000,
which also has custom based menus and toolbars etc.

These applications have been running successfully on many machines, but
recently I got problems on few pc's...When I open my Access
applications/Databases on machines (which are generating this problem)
suddenly at startup of Microsoft Access 2000 all of my Menus are deleted.
Only top level menus eg: File, Edit, Tools, Help are visible and all it's sub
item (sub menus like File > New) are deleted. And when I create or
enable/disable or set properties to those menus I got errors...

I have tried to re-make my custom menus couple of times, but they run
successfully on my development + other testing machines, but generate
errors on some problem machines...

This problem is only encountered with MS Access 2000, otherwise same
databases of previous Access 97 version are running without any menu error.

I would invite/request all experts to solve this problem.

Thanks.
 
A

Albert D.Kallal

The first basic things to check is does that target pc have all of the
office updates installed?

It makes no sense to test/check things if update to BOTH office and JET has
NOT YET been installed.

So, try the above first....
 
N

Nabeel

Yes, the machine which are generating these errors have all updates and
patches installed for Microsoft Office 2000.

Apart of this other machines which are NOT generating this error has similar
patches updated and Office 2000 has been installed and updated from the same
source and installers...

If updates would be making this kind of problems then why other machines are
NOT generating this error in Microsoft Access 2000. I addition I also have
older version of my application in Microsoft 97 as I have mentioned in my
post, Access 97 version is working absolutely FINE !

Anyways, thanks for responding...I am expecting some more authentic solutions.
 
A

Albert D.Kallal

Nabeel said:
Yes, the machine which are generating these errors have all updates and
patches installed for Microsoft Office 2000.
Click to expand...

And also the updates to jet? correct?
If updates would be making this kind of problems then why other machines
are
NOT generating this error in Microsoft Access 2000.
Click to expand...

Hum, I don't understand the above statement at all???? I in no way hinted or
implied that installing the updates would break things. Are you now saying
that installing the updates on machines is what caused the problem? If I
read you correct, you said that some machines have the updates, and are
fine, and other machines that have the updates don't work. So, why, how, or
when would one logically make the conclusion that installing the updates
would break things? If I have compete miss-read your post, please to clearly
this to me, but I don't understand your response above at all? I did not
hint, or imply or say that installing the updates would be a source of
problems. In 99% of the cases, it is the LACK OF updates and bug fixes that
have been applied that causes problems.

I would try importing all objects into a new blank file. I would also try
testing this as a mde to see if that helps.

I would also try compiling the mdb on one of those target pc's that don't
work. Can they create a mde ok? (this will narrow down references problems).
Does the mde work ok?

So, the ONLY thing we can conclude right now is that something is different
on those problem machines, but we don't know what (do you deploy office with
user profiles via a domain sever?) . So, first, make sure all machines are
same version of ms-access (ie: same patch level), and also for JET. You
mentioned that you checked and ensured that all machines are the same
patched version for both access AND jet (very important to update JET also).
Assuming this is done, then the next thing is to check references. A quick
way is via my suggestions to try and compile the mdb to a mde ON THE
problem machine.

The above things are what I would try first. If compiling and creating a
mde works fine on the problem machine, but still does not show the menu,
then perhaps security, or restrictions on the registry are at play here.

If none of the above tests result in the mde not compiling (this would be
good!..then you can hunt down a reference problem!), then we got a difficult
problem, and I don't have a solution.

At this point, if none of the above bears any fruit, then I would look at:

Does the machine have multiple versions of access?
Does the office 2000 installer "display" when it is launched (a sure
sign that things are messed up).
Are you running some virus protection software?
 
N

Nabeel

Hi,

I think you haven't read what I had posted and replied earlier carefully.
You just mis-understood what I had mentioned in my post.

Therefore, I suggest you to go through my reply to your first messege ( on
8/26/2005 6:54 AM PST) ONCE AGAIN ! There I had mentioned VERY CLEARLY that :
* "Yes, the machine which are generating these errors have ALL updates and
patches installed for Microsoft Office 2000."

and I had continued my messege as :

* "Apart of this other machines which are NOT generating this error has
similar
patches updated and Office 2000 has been installed and updated from the same
source and installers..."

These 2 sentences CLEARLY state that Iam saying that I have updated both
machines ( which are generating or not generating errors ) with SIMILAR
LATEST AVAILABLE PATCHES ! OK...

And more precisely I sould say that I have "Microsoft Office 2000
Professional edition with Service Release 3" updated with all available
patches from www.office.microsoft.com as on Aug-26-2005 ! Ok

Regarding your point : >>>
* "If updates would be making this kind of problems then why other machines
are
NOT generating this error in Microsoft Access 2000."
I again suggest you to read my messege in sequence as I have wriiten it. If
you had read this sentence with the prior one you must have found why I had
wriiten it... To clarify it more, I sould make it easy for you : "I said that
: I had updated SIMILAR patches on ALL machines, therefore If updates would
be making this kind of problems then why other machines are NOT generating
this error in Microsoft Access 2000. (as ALL machines have SAME PATCHES
INSTALLED.. OFFICE+JET)"


See, I dunt want to comment alot on your logical point of view regarding
Microsoft updates etc. I just want to say that if updates and service packs
were that efficient and foolproof, then WHY SHOULD MICROSOFT RELEASED ROLLUP
FOR WINDOWS 2000 SP 4 :) after soo long...Anyways, leave it ! let's try to
solve the real problem. See, Iam also very concious about UPDATING softwares
all the times, that's why I had updated ALL microsoft Products including
Windows/Office and MDAC/Jet to it's latest availabe ONLINE patches as on
Aug-26-2005.

I also like to mention that I had already done all the routine checkpoint
tasks like checking the references and making Menus again or using a blank
database and making or importing menu's in new database. I had posted this
exceptional case after trying all these routine processess.

I think I have tried to clarify most of the point to you, Iam still no where
near solution, buddy. I still hope to have something that could solve this
problem for me.

I appreciate that you are the only one who had got the courage to reply to
my post as yet.

thanks,
Nabeel Shahid.
 
A

Albert D.Kallal

If updates would
be making this kind of problems then why other machines are NOT generating
this error in Microsoft Access 2000

It is possible that the updates are not able to get installed correctly on
those machines. We don't know the above yet (at least I don't!!). So, we
still don't know if the updates (or better put lack of) updates is a
problem...got it???

.. However, lets assume that the updates are installing correctly, then yes,
it is a done deal, and we eliminate this issue.

As mentioned, assuming we eliminate the updates issue, then the next areas
would be to try compiling software, and creating a mde on that problem
machine.

Further, do all applications exist this menu problem on that machine? You
could try and test another application with custom menus on that machine,and
see if it works. I have a sample mdb download (a2000) with custom menus
here:
http://www.members.shaw.ca/AlbertKallal/msaccess/DownLoad.htm
(grab the 3rd one called "with ms-access interface hidden).

I would also consider taking a look to see if a user profile exists on the
offending machine, as that is another real possibility.

That key is:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Office\9.0\Access\Profiles

I would actually delete the above key if one exists (normally, the above key
does not exist).

Another area I would check is for damaged workgroup file.

So, try a few of the above things...and see what happens...

By the way, I did a Google newsgroup search, and a user had your problem
with 1 out of 250 machines he had. Sadly, the problem was not resolved, or
at least if it was, the poster did not say so.

So, one more thing, if you do find the solution...share it here....
 
N

Nabeel

Hi,

Yes, I had other applicatons running fine but they are on Microsoft Access
97. If you see my first Question post, you'll find the details there.

My Applicaitons using Access 2000 are making problems like this, other wise
Access 97 databases are running fine on ALL the machines...

I had gone through this Registry settings as well, no profile sub key
defined. One MVP told me to delete all the keys in command bar key of
registry. I haven't done that as I can't try this on without prior SYSTEM
BACKUP ! and it will take time...

But, please note one thing that I had made my users to RE-INSTALL the Office
2000 again which resets all the registry keys in
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\Microsoft\Office\9.0

I had searched this on couple of top rated Search engine's and forums, but
didn't got any thing really close to work...Even most of the forums even
didn't answered my problem.

Let's see what is it going to end up with ?

It was really good to have replies from you,
Thanks,
Nabeel Shahid.

===========================================
 
D

david epsom dot com dot au

defined. One MVP told me to delete all the keys in command bar key of
registry. I haven't done that as I can't try this on without prior SYSTEM
Click to expand...

Just rename the key. You can rename it back again if you don't
like what you get.

Or just login as a different user.

But it is harmless anyway: all the toolbar settings are
recreated to the default values if the key is missing.

(david)
 
A

Albert D.Kallal

Hum, this is indeed a strange one.

So all applications with custom menus fail on that machine, or just the one?

Gee, if all other applications with custom menus fails here, then I am at a
loss.

What happens if you try and design a custom menu while on that problem
machine? Can you even make a menu, and THEN does it get deleted (I am
grasping for ideas to try, but it would be strange if you could NOT even
create a menu on that machine..).
 
G

Guest

I think the idea about deleting the registry key was a good one.
Remember that if you hide a menu you get the same effect as
if it was deleted on startup.

(david)
 
N

Nabeel

Hi,

Yes, all of the applications in MS Access 2000 are behaving like this...That
customized menus in all applications are corrupted at startup of MS Access
2000.

But one thing that should be noticed is, only menu commandbars are corrupted
during startup, otherwise toolbars which are also a part or type of
commandbars collection in MS Access 2000 is working absolutely fine on ALL
machines.

If you see, in registry settings and other settings files for MS Access
2000, Access stores these settings in commandbars colletion / subkey. How
come is this possible that only menu's in Access 2000 are corrupted and
toolbars are not...?

See, I have a lot of customized menus that are in database, so I can't just
try and see by remaking all menus on the problem machine from the sctrach.
So, the only chance for me to get it working is either to import menu's from
some database or make it on my development machine.

As far as registry is concerned, Iam not convinced because of few things:
1 - MS Access 2000 has same collection / storage settings keys for
Menus/toolbars/popup menus in commandBar Collection. How is this possible
that only Menu Object is corrupted.
2 - I can't take risk on the machines which are generating this error, as
they are frequently used by my clients and they have very important data on
that machine. For this Iam trying to re-create this senario on my test
machine, where I can play with registry etc.


Thanks,
Nabeel Shahid.

=====================================================
 
A

Albert D.Kallal

2 - I can't take risk on the machines which are generating this error

I have to agree with the above. ....you do want to find a fix.
Yes, all of the applications in MS Access 2000 are behaving like
this...That
customized menus in all applications are corrupted at startup of MS Access
2000.
Click to expand...

Hum, what about a simple test database on that machine? Can you even create
menu bars? What actually happens when you try creating a test BLANK
database on that problem machine? Can you then create a test form, and a
custom menu bar? Does it let you create a menu bar? What actually happens
when you try and create a menu on that bad machine?

I recall a client of mine having a problem on ONE machine. The only way I
resolved this was to bring the mdb on site (I had delivered to them a mde,
which of course hides all execute errors anyway - one great reason to use a
mde by the way as your variables never get re-set, even with NO error
handling!!). When I installed the application on that bad machine, I found
the problem was a outlook reference (it was not broken, but it cased the
application to fail as a mdb, but no errors with the mde). My simple fix was
then to use late binding for the outlook.

So, while I agree you got to get this fixed on your development machine, you
need to try a simple test on that bad machine. So, create a blank mdb,
create a test form, and then create a test menu (this only a few minutes to
work!). Now, what happens? (again, I stress we are doing this on the bad
machine). If the menus work at this point, then we are on to something.
(and, if they don't work, or you can't even create menus, then that install
of office is obviously damaged). So, if you can't even make a basic form +
menu on the machine, then NOTHING will fix this on your development machine.
So, you got to try this!! (and, if it works, can you move the mdb back to
your dev machine and use it?).

And, if you CAN create and use custom menus, then we might find out
something here in terms of different library. While re-installing office
overwrites most things, the version of JET, and a number of other things
like profiles do NOT Get updated when you install (or re-install) office.
Further, runtime editions of office etc. can point to a DIFFERENT profile
location.

So, I would try making a blank mdb on that machine. (and, then take a look
at the references at this point - that is your basic benchmark for what
references will work). I would then try to create a test form. and then a
custom menu for that test form. What happens? does it work?
 
N

Nabeel

Hi,

In short, I had done all these practices similarly the way you had
specified...

I found that I was able to re-create customized menus through (custom drag
drop functionality AND also cfrom VBA code) successfully...in the same
database on the same problem machine.

But unfortunately, when I restart MS Access 2000 with the same database,
those CUSTOMIZED menus are corrupted / deleted at startup of database :-(

Thanks,
Nabeel Shahid.


====================================================
 
A

Albert D.Kallal

But unfortunately, when I restart MS Access 2000 with the same database,
those CUSTOMIZED menus are corrupted / deleted at startup of database :-(

Thanks,
Nabeel Shahid.


====================================================
Click to expand...
 
A

Albert D.Kallal

Sorry, bumped send key..

Hum, you could check if the main form, or switch board set to both model +
popup to yes. ....

You could try and remove the startup form......
(I don't think the above matters...but model+popup settings do disable menu
bars in a form).
 
N

Nabeel

Hi,

Come on..what's wrong with you...It seems that you had really been hitting
the keys by mistake! :)

How do this idea came to you that I would not have considered this...?
Anyways, what can I say regarding your question...

Consider that I don't have my menus on my starrtup form or main switchboard...
Iam trying to create custom menus that are shown on application tool bar
like "Database and Main Menu" default commandbars for Microsoft Access.

I think this senario would be easy for you to understand, and you are NOT
going to ask me to REMOVE my startup form again...

Thanks,
Syed Nabeel Shahid.

=====================================================
 
S

Steven Reider

Did you ever resolve this issue? I have the same issue, top menu bar shows
fine but items under each menu topic are blank, and other errors ensue. I am
guessing possibly it surrounds registry of ms09.dll (Office object library).

As in your case, only one of many users is encountering this -- and all
worked fine until we recently updated the file (but the update worked fine
for all others).

Let me know if you learned a cause/solution, thanks.

Steve
 
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