Paragraph Spacing (Before and After)---Exactly

[faceman28208]

I am trying to figure out how much spacing is used for paragraph
changes.

If I have a paragraph style S, that is 12 pt. font and spacing is set
to EXACTLY 14 pt. and paragraph style D that is set to EXACTLY 24 pt
with a 12 pt font as well. And I type


DDDDD
DDDDD
SSSS
SSSS
DDDD
DDDD

There is a spacing between D to S
and a spacing between S to D.

How can I set S's Before and After to get an exact spacing of 12 pt.
in those gaps? In other words, what spacing is Word using in such a
situation and what do I need to get to it to get my spacing?

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

When you set "Exactly" spacing, you are adding to (or sometimes reducing)
the amount of leading that is built into the font. This varies from one font
to another based on its design. For Times New Roman, "single" spacing is
approximately 120% of the nominal point size, so 10-pt TNR is
(approximately) 12 pts baseline to baseline.

When you increase the spacing by using Multiple or Exact spacing, you add
space above, below, or both. In Multiple spacing (such as double spacing),
the extra space is added below the text. In Exactly spacing, the excess is
added above unless you enable the Compatibility Option "Don't center 'exact
line height' lines." This is a bit misleading, since they aren't vertically
centered to begin with, but this does at least make them more compatible
with Multiple spacing.

Your 14-pt spacing may well be a little less than the default Single
spacing, so it's not adding anything. The 24-point spacing is adding 10
points more than the 14-pt (and probably adding less than 10 points compared
to Single), so if you wanted 12 pts space, you'd probably need to add at
least 2 pts Spacing Before to D or Spacing After to S.

Note that if you add both Spacing Before and Spacing After, when the two
meet, only the larger amount will be used (they will not be combined) unless
you check the Compatibility Option for "Don't use HTML paragraph auto
spacing."

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

 

[Klaus Linke]

One way would be to set both styles to "exactly 14 pt" leading, and do the
10 pt larger spacing in the "D" style with 5 pt before and 5 pt after.

As Suzanne said, the leading is usually about 120% of the font size. Since
you're setting the leading to "exactly", that doesn't matter though.

If you want to do calculations, you'd need the height of upper case
characters (about 70% of the font size, depending on the font) and lower
case letters (about 55% of the font size).

Regards,
Klaus

 

[Klaus Linke]

BTW, if you really plan to name your styles "S(ingle)" and "D(ouble)", you
might reconsider setting them to 14 pt leading and 24 pt leading. It might
be confusing later when "Double" isn't double the line spacing.

Klaus

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Good catch, Klaus. It didn't even occur to me that S and D might stand for
"single" and "double."

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

 

[faceman28208]

Maybe let me rephrase. Yes, I was using S and D to stand for single
and double. Would not be the style names.

Suppose have D which I set up for 12 pt font with 24 spacing. (12 pt
leading after)
Suppose I have S which I set up for 12 pt with 14 spacing (2 pt
leading)

If I have D paragraph followed by S paragraph followed by D paragraph,
how can I figure out what spacing will give exactly 12 pt between the
S and D paragraphs????

If I make the fonts [say] 14 pt with 28 spacing for D
12 point with 16 spacing for S

Now how much space do I need to have exactly 14 pt between D and S?

In other Words, how much space is Word putting between paragraphs when
the paragraph changes? Knowing that, I can figure out how much to add.

Dealing with government rules that need exact spacing where double
spaced transtions to single and back to double. Specs call for 2 pt
leading (for font sizes of 11, 12, 13 and 14) which is bit less than
the page layout software 120%. Word appanertly uses the internal
leading of the font, so some font font leadings at 12 pt turn out less
than 2 pt. The double always turns out to be more than 2xfont height.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

If you're required to have 2 points leading, then 14-pt spacing is what you
have to have, but if double spacing is supposed to be double that, then you
need to use 28 pts instead of 24. But what we've been trying to get across
is that there is no way you can ensure exactly 12 points space between the
actual text characters except by trial and error and measuring.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

 

[Terry Farrell]

....especially as EVERY printer is different and what may look perfect on
your printer may be totally wrong on another printer. Can you tell us why
the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced? Ordinarily, if Word is set to
give Space After set to At Least x pt and Space Before is set to zero, the
text looks evenly spaced. However, most cryptographers would state that for
ease of reading, the lines are far too close. For a 12 pt font, At Least 16
pt is far easier to read on a whole page of text (depending on the font in
question).

--
Terry Farrell - MSWord MVP

If you're required to have 2 points leading, then 14-pt spacing is what
you have to have, but if double spacing is supposed to be double that,
then you need to use 28 pts instead of 24. But what we've been trying to
get across is that there is no way you can ensure exactly 12 points space
between the actual text characters except by trial and error and
measuring.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

Maybe let me rephrase. Yes, I was using S and D to stand for single
and double. Would not be the style names.

Suppose have D which I set up for 12 pt font with 24 spacing. (12 pt
leading after)
Suppose I have S which I set up for 12 pt with 14 spacing (2 pt
leading)

If I have D paragraph followed by S paragraph followed by D paragraph,
how can I figure out what spacing will give exactly 12 pt between the
S and D paragraphs????

If I make the fonts [say] 14 pt with 28 spacing for D
12 point with 16 spacing for S

Now how much space do I need to have exactly 14 pt between D and S?

In other Words, how much space is Word putting between paragraphs when
the paragraph changes? Knowing that, I can figure out how much to add.

Dealing with government rules that need exact spacing where double
spaced transtions to single and back to double. Specs call for 2 pt
leading (for font sizes of 11, 12, 13 and 14) which is bit less than
the page layout software 120%. Word appanertly uses the internal
leading of the font, so some font font leadings at 12 pt turn out less
than 2 pt. The double always turns out to be more than 2xfont height.

 

[faceman28208]

...especially as EVERY printer is different and what may look perfect on
your printer may be totally wrong on another printer. Can you tell us why
the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced?

Government regulations.

Text ranges from 12-14 pt.

Single spaced text with 2 pt. leading.
Double spaced text with the font height leading.
Gaps between double and single spaced text to be the font height.

Ours is not to wonder why.....

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Can you tell us why the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced?

He's told us why: GOVERNMENT RULES!

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

...especially as EVERY printer is different and what may look perfect on
your printer may be totally wrong on another printer. Can you tell us why
the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced? Ordinarily, if Word is set
to give Space After set to At Least x pt and Space Before is set to zero,
the text looks evenly spaced. However, most cryptographers would state
that for ease of reading, the lines are far too close. For a 12 pt font,
At Least 16 pt is far easier to read on a whole page of text (depending on
the font in question).

--
Terry Farrell - MSWord MVP

If you're required to have 2 points leading, then 14-pt spacing is what
you have to have, but if double spacing is supposed to be double that,
then you need to use 28 pts instead of 24. But what we've been trying to
get across is that there is no way you can ensure exactly 12 points space
between the actual text characters except by trial and error and
measuring.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

Maybe let me rephrase. Yes, I was using S and D to stand for single
and double. Would not be the style names.

Suppose have D which I set up for 12 pt font with 24 spacing. (12 pt
leading after)
Suppose I have S which I set up for 12 pt with 14 spacing (2 pt
leading)

If I have D paragraph followed by S paragraph followed by D paragraph,
how can I figure out what spacing will give exactly 12 pt between the
S and D paragraphs????

If I make the fonts [say] 14 pt with 28 spacing for D
12 point with 16 spacing for S

Now how much space do I need to have exactly 14 pt between D and S?

In other Words, how much space is Word putting between paragraphs when
the paragraph changes? Knowing that, I can figure out how much to add.

Dealing with government rules that need exact spacing where double
spaced transtions to single and back to double. Specs call for 2 pt
leading (for font sizes of 11, 12, 13 and 14) which is bit less than
the page layout software 120%. Word appanertly uses the internal
leading of the font, so some font font leadings at 12 pt turn out less
than 2 pt. The double always turns out to be more than 2xfont height.

 

[Terry Farrell]

Ah! Government rules; a very familiar problem usually caused by promoting a
useless, unqualified civil servant into a position of power wielded without
thought or understanding.

Terry

Can you tell us why the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced?

He's told us why: GOVERNMENT RULES!

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

...especially as EVERY printer is different and what may look perfect on
your printer may be totally wrong on another printer. Can you tell us why
the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced? Ordinarily, if Word is set
to give Space After set to At Least x pt and Space Before is set to zero,
the text looks evenly spaced. However, most cryptographers would state
that for ease of reading, the lines are far too close. For a 12 pt font,
At Least 16 pt is far easier to read on a whole page of text (depending
on the font in question).

--
Terry Farrell - MSWord MVP

If you're required to have 2 points leading, then 14-pt spacing is what
you have to have, but if double spacing is supposed to be double that,
then you need to use 28 pts instead of 24. But what we've been trying to
get across is that there is no way you can ensure exactly 12 points
space between the actual text characters except by trial and error and
measuring.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

Maybe let me rephrase. Yes, I was using S and D to stand for single
and double. Would not be the style names.

Suppose have D which I set up for 12 pt font with 24 spacing. (12 pt
leading after)
Suppose I have S which I set up for 12 pt with 14 spacing (2 pt
leading)

If I have D paragraph followed by S paragraph followed by D paragraph,
how can I figure out what spacing will give exactly 12 pt between the
S and D paragraphs????

If I make the fonts [say] 14 pt with 28 spacing for D
12 point with 16 spacing for S

Now how much space do I need to have exactly 14 pt between D and S?

In other Words, how much space is Word putting between paragraphs when
the paragraph changes? Knowing that, I can figure out how much to add.

Dealing with government rules that need exact spacing where double
spaced transtions to single and back to double. Specs call for 2 pt
leading (for font sizes of 11, 12, 13 and 14) which is bit less than
the page layout software 120%. Word appanertly uses the internal
leading of the font, so some font font leadings at 12 pt turn out less
than 2 pt. The double always turns out to be more than 2xfont height.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

....or knowledge of the limitations of Word.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

Ah! Government rules; a very familiar problem usually caused by promoting
a useless, unqualified civil servant into a position of power wielded
without thought or understanding.

Terry

Can you tell us why the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced?

He's told us why: GOVERNMENT RULES!

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

...especially as EVERY printer is different and what may look perfect on
your printer may be totally wrong on another printer. Can you tell us
why the spacing has to be so meticulously spaced? Ordinarily, if Word is
set to give Space After set to At Least x pt and Space Before is set to
zero, the text looks evenly spaced. However, most cryptographers would
state that for ease of reading, the lines are far too close. For a 12 pt
font, At Least 16 pt is far easier to read on a whole page of text
(depending on the font in question).

--
Terry Farrell - MSWord MVP

If you're required to have 2 points leading, then 14-pt spacing is what
you have to have, but if double spacing is supposed to be double that,
then you need to use 28 pts instead of 24. But what we've been trying
to get across is that there is no way you can ensure exactly 12 points
space between the actual text characters except by trial and error and
measuring.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

Maybe let me rephrase. Yes, I was using S and D to stand for single
and double. Would not be the style names.

Suppose have D which I set up for 12 pt font with 24 spacing. (12 pt
leading after)
Suppose I have S which I set up for 12 pt with 14 spacing (2 pt
leading)

If I have D paragraph followed by S paragraph followed by D paragraph,
how can I figure out what spacing will give exactly 12 pt between the
S and D paragraphs????

If I make the fonts [say] 14 pt with 28 spacing for D
12 point with 16 spacing for S

Now how much space do I need to have exactly 14 pt between D and S?

In other Words, how much space is Word putting between paragraphs when
the paragraph changes? Knowing that, I can figure out how much to add.

Dealing with government rules that need exact spacing where double
spaced transtions to single and back to double. Specs call for 2 pt
leading (for font sizes of 11, 12, 13 and 14) which is bit less than
the page layout software 120%. Word appanertly uses the internal
leading of the font, so some font font leadings at 12 pt turn out less
than 2 pt. The double always turns out to be more than 2xfont height.

 

[faceman28208]

Ah! Government rules; a very familiar problem usually caused by promotinga
useless, unqualified civil servant into a position of power wielded without
thought or understanding.

You know it. I was trying to spare you folks much of the details. On
the place side, it has taught me some new stuff about word I had not
looked at before.

On interesting thing I have discovered.

In my text, with the gaps between spacing transitions

DDDDD
GAP 1
SSSSS
SSSSS
SSSSS
GAP 2
DDDDD

If I just use plain double and single spacing, the GAP 1 is the
biggest.
If I use exactly 2x Font height and Font height+2 exact spacing, GAP 2
is the biggest.


Likewise, if I take a blank page, put double spaced text, Word starts
the text at the upper margin.
If I use text spaced exactly 2xheight, Word starts the text down, away
from the margin, a distance slighly less than the font height.