Entourage & Exchange

[JE McGimpsey]

It is inexcuseable that Microsoft has decided to remove the exchange support
in the Home and Student version of Office 2008. <br><br>How do we fix this?
<br><br>Go to Help: Provide Feedback. This feeback goes directly to the
developers. We need to create a lot of feedback and provide some logic for
Microsoft to create an update and add the exchange support. Students
shouldn't have to be 150 more dollars for one minor thing. And the whole
concept of a student version is to provide the same software at a cheaper
price. <br><br>SEND FEEDBACK-Hopefully we will be listened to.

By all means send feedback, but if you're in a school environment that
uses Exchange, a cheaper alternative (in the past, at least, I haven't
seen anything on Office 2008) is a volume client license provided
through your institution. Of course, that means your school has to be
willing to support Macs.

There may be good marketing reasons why students should get cheaper
prices (i.e., to hook you on the product so you're more likely to buy a
full version after graduation), but there's no *inherent* reason why
simply having a student status makes one especially deserving of a price
break.

And Exchange services are hardly "one minor thing"...

 

[William Smith]

That's as may be, but as far as I can tell (three different IT shops) if
people have to do *anything* different to support the Mac, the response
will be to "buy a PC" or "use parallels." I'm trying to get Entourage
2008 working with a hosted exchange company (liveoffice.com) and after
hours of trying various combinations of user/domain/url have started
getting "resource forbidden" messages. Those guys won't even take a
support call about a mac issue, and neither will our internal IT who
picked them as our vendor. Is it really that hard to have the same
protocols? IMAP works great, but the whole point here is for the calendar.

I can't resolve your issue but thought I'd add my viewpoint.

Adam has touched on the problem which is your IT department and those
they hire are Windows-centric. Windows does not have a track record of
being compatible with anything else other than itself.

Entourage and a lot of network applications on the Mac platform are
based on standards outside of Microsoft's proprietary ways of doing
things. These are open standards that belong to no one whereas Microsoft
owns MAPI. Sure, MAPI works great just like Office for Windows runs
great on Windows running on an NTFS formatted hard drive. Microsoft owns
all of those technologies. But they don't freely share them with anyone
else.

The MacBU (yes, part of Microsoft but not Windows-centric) made a good
decision to use standards in developing Entourage rather than creating
another proprietary protocol application. The Mac OS X platform is not a
platform for promoting propriety. It has embraced open standards and the
MacBU has simply followed the Macintosh way rather than the Microsoft
way. Good for them. I applaud that.

I'm in Mac technical support myself, so believe me when I say I do feel
your pain. But if I were going to blame anyone it would be those that
think like Microsoft.

--

bill

William M. Smith, Microsoft Interop MVP - Mac/Windows
Entourage Help Page <http://entourage.mvps.org/>
Entourage Help Blog <http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/>

 

[Jon]

bill wrote:

I'm in Mac technical support myself, so believe me when I say I do feel your pain. But if I were going to blame anyone it would be those that think like Microsoft.

Oh I agree that the default attitude of "if it's at all different, squash it" in a lot of IT shops is the root cause here. I'm just frustrated that I cannot be sure of why I can't connect. I don't think it would be that unreasonable for Entourage (especially this long into the evolution of the product) to at least take the same configuration options or throw useable error messages. (If it could parse the auto-setup files that are distributed for Outlook users, that would be ideal.)

In an ideal world, you could at least copy your OWA login URL, paste it into the setup wizard, use the same user/password and get something meaningful back.

I have a gloriously detailed setup guide for Outlook 2007, which does me no good at all. Do I tack /OWA to the hostname? Is it /exchange/[email protected]? Outlook/OWA don't ask for a user domain, why does Entourage? Should there be an https:// in front of the URL? What about all the config around an Exchange proxy, is there any way to do that? As far as I can tell, the only way to debug that stuff in Entourage (assuming you have no cooperation from the server side guys) is to just try all possible combinations, with most failures being silent. (Is there a log file somewhere?)

Entourage looks great - I *love* the ability to sync contacts/calendars with the native apple stuff (which I vaguely remember Mac BU people saying was out of scope for this release last year or so.) Very pleasant surprise (and seems to be working right off the bat.) At first glance I see more promising new features in Entourage than in any other part of Office 2008.

In my last company, the Mac users banded together and supported Entourage for each other talking to our Exchange servers. (The "don't ask, don't tell" policy for Mac support.) I hear 2008 is working great for those guys, so in no way do I think this isn't a great step forward. Just wish the DNA of the average Exchange admin was a bit more supportive.

 

[Fred Gilson]

Will Entourage allow access to shared folders in Outlook? I do a substantial bit of shared calendar updates and want to make sure this is supported before we make the switch to Mac.

 

[Jon]

Just got a message back from our hosted provider (liveoffice.com) which claims that Apple/Entourage cannot be made to work with any Exchange install over the web. (Apparently because "Apple does not support https" which I hope is a gross over-simplification of something true rather than just a lie.)

Anyway, I guess this is another "wait and see" situation since it's being worked on.

 

[Andy Ruff]

I¹d be surprised if that¹s the case... LiveOffice looks to support OWA. If
you put your OWA URL in Entourage, it¹ll likely work. It doesn¹t look like
they support IMAP, so Mail.app won¹t work.

That said, there are a number of hosted Exchange providers out there that
support Entourage.

-Andy

 

[Andy Ruff]

Yes, Entourage can access shared calendars, mail folders, and address books.

-Andy

 

[Andy Ruff]

Oh I agree that the default attitude of "if it's at all different, squash it"
in a lot of IT shops is the root cause here. I'm just frustrated that I cannot
be sure of why I can't connect. I don't think it would be that unreasonable
for Entourage (especially this long into the evolution of the product) to at
least take the same configuration options or throw useable error messages. (If
it could parse the auto-setup files that are distributed for Outlook users,
that would be ideal.)

In an ideal world, you could at least copy your OWA login URL, paste it into
the setup wizard, use the same user/password and get something meaningful
back.

I have a gloriously detailed setup guide for Outlook 2007, which does me no
good at all. Do I tack /OWA to the hostname? Is it /exchange/[email protected]?
Outlook/OWA don't ask for a user domain, why does Entourage? Should there be
an https:// in front of the URL? What about all the config around an Exchange
proxy, is there any way to do that? As far as I can tell, the only way to
debug that stuff in Entourage (assuming you have no cooperation from the
server side guys) is to just try all possible combinations, with most failures
being silent. (Is there a log file somewhere?)

Entourage looks great - I *love* the ability to sync contacts/calendars with
the native apple stuff (which I vaguely remember Mac BU people saying was out
of scope for this release last year or so.) Very pleasant surprise (and seems
to be working right off the bat.) At first glance I see more promising new
features in Entourage than in any other part of Office 2008.

In my last company, the Mac users banded together and supported Entourage for
each other talking to our Exchange servers. (The "don't ask, don't tell"
policy for Mac support.) I hear 2008 is working great for those guys, so in
no way do I think this isn't a great step forward. Just wish the DNA of the
average Exchange admin was a bit more supportive.

We are working directly with the Exchange team to make the configuration of
Entourage accounts much more reliable and seamless. Ideally, we'll get to
the point where you enter your e-mail address and you're done .

-Andy

 

[Adam Bailey]

Just got a message back from our hosted provider (liveoffice.com) which
claims that Apple/Entourage cannot be made to work with any Exchange
install over the web. (Apparently because "Apple does not support https"
which I hope is a gross over-simplification of something true rather than
just a lie.)

I'll go ahead and call it a lie, or at least blatant ignorance.

Of course Apple supports https, and Microsoft Entourage supports Microsoft
Exchange using OWA. Point them to
<http://www.microsoft.com/mac/itpros...rget=5dc552e3-ea74-4bba-a647-afaabe7dee531033>.

Any company so *outrageously* ignorant should not be trusted to manage your
services. I realize that's not your decision, but how would you feel if your
bank said they can't take your deposit because your wallet doesn't support
US currency? It's a ridiculous statement that you simply wouldn't accept.
This is no different.

 

[Caleb Clauset]

Something has changed with Entourage 2008 that appears to Œbreak¹ my hosted
Exchange service (USA.net). Whereas Entourage 2004 immediately authenticated
to USA.net, Entourage Œ08 stays ³not connected² and rejects the same
keychain password that worked perfectly with Œ04 with this error:

³Mail could not be received at this time. The server for account <account>
returned the error ³Logon failure: unknown user name or bad password.² Your
username/password or security settings may be incorrect. Would you like to
try re-entering your password? [No/Yes]²).

Answering ŒYes¹ prompts me for my domain, username and password, but
multiple attempts are always required (generally it doesn¹t take more than 4
tries). Quitting Entourage, switching identities or going ŒOffline¹ means
going through the whole rigamarole again. As such, Entourage Œ08 is more
trouble than it appears to be worth...

 

[Shawn]

Installed Office 2008 Home &amp; Student on my iMac, only to realize that I cannot access my Exchange account. After uninstalling 2008 and reinstalling 2004, I cannot launch Entourage...the error message reads "The identity cannot be opened with this version of Entourage." Can someone tell me how to fix this?

 

[Matthew J Mucklo]

Hello, I have a client that just had his calendar get wiped off the exchange server using Entourage 2004 SP2.

According to Tech Support and various articles on the web, this is not an uncommon problem with Entourage 2004 SP2.

We're considering a 2008 upgrade, but only if the problem was fixed.

Does anyone know if the problem was addressed and/or fixed?

 

[jayweiss]

Please stop telling us that we should have know that there was no support for Exchange in the Home and Student Edition of Office 2008.

My son needs Exchange support on his Mac in an educational environment that DOES NOT SUPPORT MACS I have to shell out HUNDREDS of dollars for ONE copy of the Office 2008 so he can continue to use it.

I want to purchase the Home and Student Edition so I don't have to spend $1,500 for Microsoft office on our three home computers.

My alternative is setup Boot Camp or Parallels or VMWare Fusion, which requires the purchase of Windows XP (because Vista sucks) and Microsoft Office 2003 or 2007 with the full version of Outlook.

Either way "I" am getting screwed.

The school in question will NOT buy him the Mac version since IT IS NOT AVAILABLE under their volume license. I can't obtain it other than purchasing the Standard Edition of Office 2008. I can't even get an answer as to who I can contact to purchase a single CAL to use Entourage with Exchange.

I normally applaud the MacBU for their efforts, but in this case I have to complain about the decisions you have made.

 

[Dylan Carlson]

I am familiar with that issue. Please call USA.net support. They have
a solution for this problem. It is not an Entourage 2008 issue.

Regards,
Dylan

Something has changed with Entourage 2008 that appears to Œbreak¹ my hosted
Exchange service (USA.net). Whereas Entourage 2004 immediately authenticated
to USA.net, Entourage Œ08 stays ³not connected² and rejects the same keychain
password that worked perfectly with Œ04 with this error:

³Mail could not be received at this time. The server for account <account>
returned the error ³Logon failure: unknown user name or bad password.² Your
username/password or security settings may be incorrect. Would you like to try
re-entering your password? [No/Yes]²).

Answering ŒYes¹ prompts me for my domain, username and password, but multiple
attempts are always required (generally it doesn¹t take more than 4 tries).
Quitting Entourage, switching identities or going ŒOffline¹ means going
through the whole rigamarole again. As such, Entourage Œ08 is more trouble
than it appears to be worth...

I¹d be surprised if that¹s the case... LiveOffice looks to support OWA. If
you put your OWA URL in Entourage, it¹ll likely work. It doesn¹t look like
they support IMAP, so Mail.app won¹t work.

That said, there are a number of hosted Exchange providers out there that
support Entourage.

-Andy

 

[Shawn]

I have been trying to get help for my previously posted problem with downgrading back to office 2004 in order to reconnect with my University exchange server. In going through Microsoft's tech support email website, every time I attempt to submit I get the following error, "An unknown application error occurred. Please try again in a few minutes." Needless to say I have tried many times over dozens of minutes and get the same result. Can anyone tell me how to get actual tech support if the support site doesn't even work?

 

[Diane Ross]

I have been trying to get help for my previously posted problem with
downgrading back to office 2004 in order to reconnect with my University
exchange server. In going through Microsoft's tech support email website,
every time I attempt to submit I get the following error, "An unknown
application error occurred. Please try again in a few minutes." Needless to
say I have tried many times over dozens of minutes and get the same result.
Can anyone tell me how to get actual tech support if the support site doesn't
even work?

Use "Remove Office" to remove all of the Office 2008 files including the
invisible ones. Next, install Office 2004. I'm not sure if "Remove Office"
removes all of the new fonts in Office 2008. See Installing Office for Mac
2008 for more info on changes to fonts and locations in 2008.

<http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/2008/01/installing_office_for_mac_2008.html>

Even if the fonts aren't removed, I don't see them causing a problem with
Office 2004.

The only problem with going backwards with Entourage would be your mail in
Entourage 2008. You will have to manually move new messages to the desktop
or use Export as Entourage archive to get your new mail back into Entourage
2004. Hopefully you still have your Office 2004 Identities folder. That
would make the change easier.

FYI... "Remove Office" is found in your Office 2004/2008 folder -->
Additional Tools folder.

I don't know what your original problem was since the new web interface
makes those of us that use a real newsreader to view posts correctly, but
have you considered installing both versions using separate Users? The blog
article mentioned above explains this approach.

BTW, If you use Entourage to subscribe to this newsgroup, you will find
using the newsgroup much easier and it will make our job easier to help you.

How to subscribe to the Microsoft Entourage newsgroup

<http://www.entourage.mvps.org/support_options/subnews.html>

 

[Corentin Cras-Méneur]

Please stop telling us that we should have know that there was no
support for Exchange in the Home and Student Edition of Office 2008.

My son needs Exchange support on his Mac in an educational environment
that DOES NOT SUPPORT MACS I have to shell out HUNDREDS of dollars for
ONE copy of the Office 2008 so he can continue to use it.

In *theory*, the school has to pay a licence for each seat on their
Exchange server. In return, they *should* get a licence for Outlook or
Entourage (full) for each client.

I would try bugging the school again to get a copy of the full version
of Entourage through them,

Corentin

 

[Corentin Cras-Méneur]

That said, there are a number of hosted Exchange providers out there that
support Entourage.

I use it daily with our server here at work. No problem accessing
Exchange from home.
I'm simplifying but I would say: If you can get your e-mails from a
webpage at home, you should be able to use the same URL as the address
of the server in Entourage to get to your Exchange account,


Corentin

 

[Caleb Clauset]

USA.net finally gave me an alternate Exchange server address for which ³the
authentication methods are slightly different² (they wouldn¹t elaborate
further) and now I can connect seamlessly with Entourage 2008 (but it took
several days of back and forth with them to obtain this information).
Hopefully whatever configuration differences they made at their end can be
shared with others hosting Exchange service so they too can connect using
Entourage 2008.

I am familiar with that issue. Please call USA.net support. They have a
solution for this problem. It is not an Entourage 2008 issue.

Regards,
Dylan

Something has changed with Entourage 2008 that appears to Œbreak¹ my hosted
Exchange service (USA.net). Whereas Entourage 2004 immediately authenticated
to USA.net, Entourage Œ08 stays ³not connected² and rejects the same keychain
password that worked perfectly with Œ04 with this error:

³Mail could not be received at this time. The server for account <account>
returned the error ³Logon failure: unknown user name or bad password.² Your
username/password or security settings may be incorrect. Would you like to
try re-entering your password? [No/Yes]²).

Answering ŒYes¹ prompts me for my domain, username and password, but multiple
attempts are always required (generally it doesn¹t take more than 4 tries).
Quitting Entourage, switching identities or going ŒOffline¹ means going
through the whole rigamarole again. As such, Entourage Œ08 is more trouble
than it appears to be worth...

I¹d be surprised if that¹s the case... LiveOffice looks to support OWA. If
you put your OWA URL in Entourage, it¹ll likely work. It doesn¹t look like
they support IMAP, so Mail.app won¹t work.

That said, there are a number of hosted Exchange providers out there that
support Entourage.

-Andy


On 1/22/08 8:35 AM, in article (e-mail address removed)9absDaxw, "Jon"
<Jon> wrote:

Just got a message back from our hosted provider (liveoffice.com) which
claims that Apple/Entourage cannot be made to work with any Exchange
install over the web. (Apparently because "Apple does not support https"
which I hope is a gross over-simplification of something true rather than
just a lie.)

Anyway, I guess this is another "wait and see" situation since it's being
worked on.

 

[Diane Ross]

Installed Office 2008 Home & Student on my iMac, only to realize that I cannot
access my Exchange account. After uninstalling 2008 and reinstalling 2004, I
cannot launch Entourage...the error message reads "The identity cannot be
opened with this version of Entourage." Can someone tell me how to fix this?

"This Identity Cannot Be Opened With This Version of Entourage"
This message usually means, for example, that Entourage is at 11.0, but the
saved database was saved in Entourage 11.3.3. Since there was a database
format change in there, Entourage 11.0 cannot open a database saved in
Entourage 11.3.3.

Microsoft does not update each application every time an update is released.
See ³Confused over Microsoft Update Version numbers?³ for a handy script
that gives you the Office application¹s version info.

<http://blog.entourage.mvps.org/2007/05/confused_over_microsoft_update.html>