Production Manufacturing

[basstwo]

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make a task
that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task "Build Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource 'boards'
and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6 hours). This equates
out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I can now increase the 30 to 40
and the duration with adjust to 1 day. But I have two thin gs I cannot
seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under 'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to complete
the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards needed from 30 to 40
it now stops adjusting the duration (it stays at 0.75 days) and it
won't increase the hours 'Bob' must work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to make
another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH task and
change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for the "Build Boards"
task, various other numbers for other tasks depending on how many are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out quantities
and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds dangerous...so I make the
'work' value link to the value in Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[Rod Gill]

You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is not suited
for production control for reasons you've just discovered. And image if you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and end points
and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs production software,
ideally as an add-on top your accounts system.

 

[bob]

I might be in the same situation.

We try to show total time for a line item, Monday to Sunday, and it shows 5
days duration. Well, it's not 5, it's 7. But to do that, we have to show
working 7 days/week. However, we work 5. But we still need to know total
time--not just working days.

Of course, adding a task really screws things up.

I can set the daily hours to 40/7 [7 days a week] but then all the tasks are
messed up.

Project is unable to understand this? So, I should just stop trying to fix
it?

[just bought this program, based on MS advertising, and VERY disappointed
that Project cannot seem to comprehend this basically simple concept: we
work 5 days a week, but want total day durations]

Or am I missing something simple?

You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is not suited
for production control for reasons you've just discovered. And image if you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and end points
and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs production software,
ideally as an add-on top your accounts system.

 

[bob]

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F, M-F, M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us major
problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual 19 days?

thanks

You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is not suited
for production control for reasons you've just discovered. And image if you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and end points
and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs production software,
ideally as an add-on top your accounts system.

 

[JulieS]

Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if Saturday and
Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom calendar.
Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy the Standard
calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays & Sundays working days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in the task
table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the [Duration1] field.
Click the Formula... button and use the following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option for the
task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start of the
task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F, M-F,
M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us major
problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual 19 days?

thanks

 

[bob]

Many thanks! I will try this first thing monday am. Program is at work, and
my weekend task was to try and find help! Looks like you did it--thanks
again.

BTW: "Duration is always measured in working time", is probably my problem.
I want "elapsed time", which is more accurate. And when somebody looks at
master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next vendor he can begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.

Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if Saturday and
Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom calendar.
Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy the Standard
calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays & Sundays working days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in the task
table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the [Duration1] field.
Click the Formula... button and use the following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option for the
task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start of the
task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F, M-F,
M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us major
problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual 19 days?

thanks

 

[JulieS]

Hi Bob,

You're most welcome for the assist and thanks for the feedback.

I hope all goes well on Monday. Let us know if you have further questions.

Julie

 

[Rod Gill]

Don't forget that the finish date will be accurate and its safer to always
quote working days anyway.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and more

Many thanks! I will try this first thing monday am. Program is at work,
and
my weekend task was to try and find help! Looks like you did it--thanks
again.

BTW: "Duration is always measured in working time", is probably my
problem.
I want "elapsed time", which is more accurate. And when somebody looks at
master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next vendor he can
begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.

Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if Saturday and
Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom calendar.
Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy the Standard
calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays & Sundays working
days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in the task
table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the [Duration1] field.
Click the Formula... button and use the following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option for the
task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start of the
task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F, M-F,
M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us major
problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual 19 days?

thanks


"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is not
suited
for production control for reasons you've just discovered. And image
if
you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and end points
and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs production software,
ideally as an add-on top your accounts system.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and more

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make a task
that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task "Build
Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource 'boards'
and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6 hours). This equates
out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I can now increase the 30 to 40
and the duration with adjust to 1 day. But I have two thin gs I cannot
seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under
'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to complete
the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards needed from 30 to 40
it now stops adjusting the duration (it stays at 0.75 days) and it
won't increase the hours 'Bob' must work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to make
another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH task and
change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for the "Build Boards"
task, various other numbers for other tasks depending on how many
are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out quantities
and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds dangerous...so I make the
'work' value link to the value in Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[bob]

"...its safer to always quote working days anyway."

Could be in some worlds, but certainly not mine. I give a vendor 180 days to
complete his phase of a project, and I don't care if he works 5 -8's, 4 -
10's, overtime, weekends, nights, whatever.
He has 180 days. Period. Unfettered access means vendor #2 begins on day
181.
I have to know total duration, or I guess more accurately called, 'elapsed
time'.

But I don't see any way for MSpro to do that.

Don't forget that the finish date will be accurate and its safer to always
quote working days anyway.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and more

Many thanks! I will try this first thing monday am. Program is at work,
and
my weekend task was to try and find help! Looks like you did it--thanks
again.

BTW: "Duration is always measured in working time", is probably my
problem.
I want "elapsed time", which is more accurate. And when somebody looks at
master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next vendor he can
begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.

Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if

Saturday
and

Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom calendar.
Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy the Standard
calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays & Sundays working
days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in the task
table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the [Duration1] field.
Click the Formula... button and use the following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option for the
task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start of the
task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F, M-F,
M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us major
problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual 19 days?

thanks


"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is not
suited
for production control for reasons you've just discovered. And image
if
you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and end points
and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs production software,
ideally as an add-on top your accounts system.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and more

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make a task
that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task "Build
Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource 'boards'
and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6 hours). This equates
out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I can now increase the 30

to
40

and the duration with adjust to 1 day. But I have two thin gs I cannot
seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under
'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to complete
the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards needed from 30

to
40

it now stops adjusting the duration (it stays at 0.75 days) and it
won't increase the hours 'Bob' must work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to make
another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH task and
change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for the "Build Boards"
task, various other numbers for other tasks depending on how many
are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out quantities
and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds dangerous...so I

make
the

'work' value link to the value in Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[Jan De Messemaeker]

Haven't you read Julie's post then?
She exactly explained how to do it in Project.

--
Jan De Messemaeker
Microsoft Project Most Valuable Professional
http://users.online.be/prom-ade/
+32-495-300 620

"...its safer to always quote working days anyway."

Could be in some worlds, but certainly not mine. I give a vendor 180 days to
complete his phase of a project, and I don't care if he works 5 -8's, 4 -
10's, overtime, weekends, nights, whatever.
He has 180 days. Period. Unfettered access means vendor #2 begins on day
181.
I have to know total duration, or I guess more accurately called, 'elapsed
time'.

But I don't see any way for MSpro to do that.

Don't forget that the finish date will be accurate and its safer to always
quote working days anyway.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and more

looks

at

master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next vendor he can
begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.


"JulieS" <passport6847 at maine dot rr dot com> wrote in message
Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if Saturday
and
Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration field does not count
them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom
calendar.
Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy the Standard
calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays & Sundays working
days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in the task
table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the [Duration1] field.
Click the Formula... button and use the following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option for the
task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start of the
task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F, M-F,
M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us major
problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual 19
days?

thanks


"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is not
suited
for production control for reasons you've just discovered. And image
if
you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and end
points
and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs production software,
ideally as an add-on top your accounts system.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and more

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make a
task
that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task "Build
Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource 'boards'
and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6 hours). This
equates
out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I can now increase the 30 to
40
and the duration with adjust to 1 day. But I have two thin gs I
cannot
seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under
'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to complete
the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards needed from 30 to
40
it now stops adjusting the duration (it stays at 0.75 days) and it
won't increase the hours 'Bob' must work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to make
another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH task and
change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for the "Build
Boards"
task, various other numbers for other tasks depending on how many
are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out quantities
and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds dangerous...so I make
the
'work' value link to the value in Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[Mike Glen]

Hi Bob,

If you want such a simplistic schedule, just give him 180edays.


Mike Glen
Project MVP

"...its safer to always quote working days anyway."

Could be in some worlds, but certainly not mine. I give a vendor 180
days to complete his phase of a project, and I don't care if he works
5 -8's, 4 - 10's, overtime, weekends, nights, whatever.
He has 180 days. Period. Unfettered access means vendor #2 begins on
day 181.
I have to know total duration, or I guess more accurately called,
'elapsed time'.

But I don't see any way for MSpro to do that.

Don't forget that the finish date will be accurate and its safer to
always quote working days anyway.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and
more

Many thanks! I will try this first thing monday am. Program is at
work, and
my weekend task was to try and find help! Looks like you did
it--thanks again.

BTW: "Duration is always measured in working time", is probably my
problem.
I want "elapsed time", which is more accurate. And when somebody
looks at master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next
vendor he can begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.


"JulieS" <passport6847 at maine dot rr dot com> wrote in message
Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if
Saturday and Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration
field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom
calendar. Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy
the Standard calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays &
Sundays working days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in
the task table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the
[Duration1] field. Click the Formula... button and use the
following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option
for the task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start
of the task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F,
M-F, M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us
major problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual
19 days?

thanks


"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is
not suited for production control for reasons you've just
discovered. And image if
you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and
end points and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs
production software, ideally as an add-on top your accounts
system.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools
and more

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make
a task that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task
"Build Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource
'boards' and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6
hours). This equates out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I
can now increase the 30 to 40 and the duration with adjust to 1
day. But I have two thin gs I cannot seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under
'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to
complete the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards
needed from 30 to 40 it now stops adjusting the duration (it
stays at 0.75 days) and it won't increase the hours 'Bob' must
work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to
make another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH
task and change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for
the "Build Boards" task, various other numbers for other tasks
depending on how many are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out
quantities and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds
dangerous...so I make the 'work' value link to the value in
Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[bob]

Yes, I gratefully read Julie's post and will try that first thing Monday.
What is "e" days? Elapsed?
Yes, simplistic is most certainly welcome!

I don't need hours, resources, etc., but it could be 50 vendors working the
same site.
I need to coordinate site access, flow, sequences, etc.
We used to use Primavera P3 but it's unfair to mandate this expensive
program to a small vendor.
But they can afford Ms Project, and we all need to see the same schedule.

Hi Bob,

If you want such a simplistic schedule, just give him 180edays.


Mike Glen
Project MVP

"...its safer to always quote working days anyway."

Could be in some worlds, but certainly not mine. I give a vendor 180
days to complete his phase of a project, and I don't care if he works
5 -8's, 4 - 10's, overtime, weekends, nights, whatever.
He has 180 days. Period. Unfettered access means vendor #2 begins on
day 181.
I have to know total duration, or I guess more accurately called,
'elapsed time'.

But I don't see any way for MSpro to do that.

Don't forget that the finish date will be accurate and its safer to
always quote working days anyway.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and
more

Many thanks! I will try this first thing monday am. Program is at
work, and
my weekend task was to try and find help! Looks like you did
it--thanks again.

BTW: "Duration is always measured in working time", is probably my
problem.
I want "elapsed time", which is more accurate. And when somebody
looks at master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next
vendor he can begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.


"JulieS" <passport6847 at maine dot rr dot com> wrote in message
Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if
Saturday and Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration
field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom
calendar. Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy
the Standard calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays &
Sundays working days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in
the task table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the
[Duration1] field. Click the Formula... button and use the
following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option
for the task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start
of the task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F,
M-F, M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us
major problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual
19 days?

thanks


"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is
not suited for production control for reasons you've just
discovered. And image if
you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and
end points and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs
production software, ideally as an add-on top your accounts
system.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools
and more

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make
a task that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task
"Build Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource
'boards' and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6
hours). This equates out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I
can now increase the 30 to 40 and the duration with adjust to 1
day. But I have two thin gs I cannot seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under
'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to
complete the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards
needed from 30 to 40 it now stops adjusting the duration (it
stays at 0.75 days) and it won't increase the hours 'Bob' must
work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to
make another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH
task and change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for
the "Build Boards" task, various other numbers for other tasks
depending on how many are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out
quantities and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds
dangerous...so I make the 'work' value link to the value in
Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[JulieS]

Hi Bob,

Yes, the "e" stands for elapsed. However, the definition of an "elapsed
day" is 24 hours, not 8 hours as is set up in your project file. You can
convert duration to elapsed duration using a spare duration field and the
formula:

ProjDurConv([Duration],pjElapsedDays)

However this will produce odd results.

For example -
A task with an 8 day duration (in working time) starting on Monday (2 May
2005) will end on Wednesday (11 May 2005).
Saturday and Sunday are nonworking days, so the duration field only shows 8
days.

In the formula I listed for you yesterday, the calculated duration is 10
days - because the calendar used in the formula defines Saturday and Sunday
as working days.

In the formula above, the calculated duration shows 2.67 edays because the
definition of a day is 24 hours.

Hope this helps to clarify. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

Yes, I gratefully read Julie's post and will try that first thing Monday.
What is "e" days? Elapsed?
Yes, simplistic is most certainly welcome!

I don't need hours, resources, etc., but it could be 50 vendors working
the
same site.
I need to coordinate site access, flow, sequences, etc.
We used to use Primavera P3 but it's unfair to mandate this expensive
program to a small vendor.
But they can afford Ms Project, and we all need to see the same schedule.

Hi Bob,

If you want such a simplistic schedule, just give him 180edays.


Mike Glen
Project MVP

"...its safer to always quote working days anyway."

Could be in some worlds, but certainly not mine. I give a vendor 180
days to complete his phase of a project, and I don't care if he works
5 -8's, 4 - 10's, overtime, weekends, nights, whatever.
He has 180 days. Period. Unfettered access means vendor #2 begins on
day 181.
I have to know total duration, or I guess more accurately called,
'elapsed time'.

But I don't see any way for MSpro to do that.



"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
Don't forget that the finish date will be accurate and its safer to
always quote working days anyway.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and
more

Many thanks! I will try this first thing monday am. Program is at
work, and
my weekend task was to try and find help! Looks like you did
it--thanks again.

BTW: "Duration is always measured in working time", is probably my
problem.
I want "elapsed time", which is more accurate. And when somebody
looks at master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next
vendor he can begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.


"JulieS" <passport6847 at maine dot rr dot com> wrote in message
Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if
Saturday and Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration
field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom
calendar. Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy
the Standard calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays &
Sundays working days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in
the task table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the
[Duration1] field. Click the Formula... button and use the
following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option
for the task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start
of the task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F,
M-F, M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us
major problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual
19 days?

thanks


"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is
not suited for production control for reasons you've just
discovered. And image if
you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and
end points and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs
production software, ideally as an add-on top your accounts
system.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools
and more

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make
a task that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task
"Build Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource
'boards' and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6
hours). This equates out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I
can now increase the 30 to 40 and the duration with adjust to 1
day. But I have two thin gs I cannot seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under
'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to
complete the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards
needed from 30 to 40 it now stops adjusting the duration (it
stays at 0.75 days) and it won't increase the hours 'Bob' must
work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to
make another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH
task and change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for
the "Build Boards" task, various other numbers for other tasks
depending on how many are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out
quantities and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds
dangerous...so I make the 'work' value link to the value in
Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[bob]

Yes, thanks again.
Looking forward to monday to get this working.

I am obviously very naive about this process. It seemed, at least to me,
that merely adding a task that requires "X" days to complete would be very
simple.

I guess not.

Hi Bob,

Yes, the "e" stands for elapsed. However, the definition of an "elapsed
day" is 24 hours, not 8 hours as is set up in your project file. You can
convert duration to elapsed duration using a spare duration field and the
formula:

ProjDurConv([Duration],pjElapsedDays)

However this will produce odd results.

For example -
A task with an 8 day duration (in working time) starting on Monday (2 May
2005) will end on Wednesday (11 May 2005).
Saturday and Sunday are nonworking days, so the duration field only shows 8
days.

In the formula I listed for you yesterday, the calculated duration is 10
days - because the calendar used in the formula defines Saturday and Sunday
as working days.

In the formula above, the calculated duration shows 2.67 edays because the
definition of a day is 24 hours.

Hope this helps to clarify. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

Yes, I gratefully read Julie's post and will try that first thing Monday.
What is "e" days? Elapsed?
Yes, simplistic is most certainly welcome!

I don't need hours, resources, etc., but it could be 50 vendors working
the
same site.
I need to coordinate site access, flow, sequences, etc.
We used to use Primavera P3 but it's unfair to mandate this expensive
program to a small vendor.
But they can afford Ms Project, and we all need to see the same schedule.

Hi Bob,

If you want such a simplistic schedule, just give him 180edays.


Mike Glen
Project MVP




bob wrote:
"...its safer to always quote working days anyway."

Could be in some worlds, but certainly not mine. I give a vendor 180
days to complete his phase of a project, and I don't care if he works
5 -8's, 4 - 10's, overtime, weekends, nights, whatever.
He has 180 days. Period. Unfettered access means vendor #2 begins on
day 181.
I have to know total duration, or I guess more accurately called,
'elapsed time'.

But I don't see any way for MSpro to do that.



"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
Don't forget that the finish date will be accurate and its safer to
always quote working days anyway.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools and
more

Many thanks! I will try this first thing monday am. Program is at
work, and
my weekend task was to try and find help! Looks like you did
it--thanks again.

BTW: "Duration is always measured in working time", is probably my
problem.
I want "elapsed time", which is more accurate. And when somebody
looks at master durations and sees, "30 days" and tells the next
vendor he can begin
his work in 31 days, the problems become---ah, messy.


"JulieS" <passport6847 at maine dot rr dot com> wrote in message
Hi Bob,

As you know, Duration is always measured in working time, so if
Saturday and Sunday are non-working days, the default Duration
field does not count them.

There is a work around using a custom duration field and a custom
calendar. Create a new calendar (Tools>Change Working Time). Copy
the Standard calendar, name it (I used 7Day) and make Saturdays &
Sundays working days.
Then insert a custom duration field ([Duration1] for example) in
the task table. Choose Tools>Customize Fields and select the
[Duration1] field. Click the Formula... button and use the
following formula:

ProjDateDiff([Start],[Finish],"7Day")

In the Customize fields dialog box, click the Use Formula option
for the task and group summary rows.

This will calculate the number of calendar days between the start
of the task and the finish of the task using the 7Day calendar. .

Hope this helps. Let us know how you get along.

Julie

I probably was not clear in my previous post.
I have a master with 3 subs. Each sub is 5 days in sequence. M-F,
M-F, M-F.
The master total range duration shows this as 15 days.
In reality, it's 19 days, with two weekends in between.

With a long series of Masters and subs, this really causes us
major problems.

Any way to fix the Master 'total duration' to reflect the actual
19 days?

thanks


"Rod Gill" <rod AT project-systems DOT co DOT nz> wrote in message
You've overshot the usefulness of Project I'm afraid. Project is
not suited for production control for reasons you've just
discovered. And image if
you
tried to get someone lese to update the schedule: chaos.

Project is excellent for estimating a project (known start and
end points and known outcomes). Production scheduling needs
production software, ideally as an add-on top your accounts
system.

--

Rod Gill
Project MVP
Visit www.msproject-systems.co.nz for Project Companion Tools
and more

Here is the data I have to start with: 'Bob' needs to make 30
'boards'. He does so and it takes 6 hours. I now want to make
a task that encapsulates this transaction. So I make a task
"Build Boards".
Duration = 0.75 days (6 hours). I make a material resource
'boards' and set the units to '5 boards/hour' (30 boards/6
hours). This equates out to a 'work' value of '30 boards'. I
can now increase the 30 to 40 and the duration with adjust to 1
day. But I have two thin gs I cannot seem to get to work.

First thing: If I add 'Bob' as a work resource (added under
'boards'
in the task form) it will show that he must work 6 hours to
complete the boards. But if I adjust the number of boards
needed from 30 to 40 it now stops adjusting the duration (it
stays at 0.75 days) and it won't increase the hours 'Bob' must
work from 6 to 8.

Second thing: The big project is to make 30 'boxes'. Each box
requires a 'board' along with a bunch of other tasks. So, I can
complete my schedule for a run of 30 'boxes'. But if I need to
make another run but of 40 'boxes' then do I have to go to EASH
task and change the quantities ('work' value of 30 boards for
the "Build Boards" task, various other numbers for other tasks
depending on how many are
used in a 'box') everywhere!?!
I read on a post about a guy who uses Excel to figure out
quantities and then OLEs them into Project. That sounds
dangerous...so I make the 'work' value link to the value in
Excel?

Thank you for your time! Sorry this is so long!

 

[Steve House [Project MVP]]

Project makes a very clear distinction between duration values and elapsed
time values. Elapsed time is the time kept by clocks and calendars while
duration only counts those time units defined as working time by the task's
governing calendar. Thus a 7-day week encompassing within it a typical work
schedule has 168 elapsed hours but only 40 duration hours and an elapsed day
is 24 hours but a duration day is 8 (assuming the default Standard
calendar). Why? Because progress only takes place on a task when there is
someone physically there and available to work on it. In terms of planning
an optimum work schedule to complete the required deliverables in the
minimum possible time, the only time frames that matter are working times.
The elapsed time between when a task begins and when it is done is
essentially irrelevant to planning a project for the most part. Elapsed
time only really enters the picture for items that aren't resource
dependent - setup time for concrete for example doesn't require someone
there watching it and the concrete will harden equally well during working
or non-working times. If I have to build 100 widgets and it takes one hour
for one man to build one widget, the 100 man-hours that count for scheduling
are the working hours during which my resource is going to be there. It
really doesn't matter if that is spread over 2 calendar weeks or 2 calendar
months - what I'm concerned with are the dates between which I'll have 100
hours of a resource's working time available.

This is not a peculiarity of MS Project, by the way. The distinction
between duration and elapsed time is a fundamental concept in the discipline
of critical path scheduling whether done with software or by paper and
pencil methods. For a complete discussion I'd suggest you review the
chapters in the Guide to the PMBOK from the Project Management Institute.

I might be in the same situation.

We try to show total time for a line item, Monday to Sunday, and it shows
5
days duration. Well, it's not 5, it's 7. But to do that, we have to show
working 7 days/week. However, we work 5. But we still need to know total
time--not just working days.

Of course, adding a task really screws things up.

I can set the daily hours to 40/7 [7 days a week] but then all the tasks
are
messed up.

Project is unable to understand this? So, I should just stop trying to fix
it?

[just bought this program, based on MS advertising, and VERY disappointed
that Project cannot seem to comprehend this basically simple concept: we
work 5 days a week, but want total day durations]

Or am I missing something simple?