Vector format images

[tmdesign]

Version: 2004
Operating System: Mac OS X 10.4 (Tiger)
Processor: Power PC

Hi - I'm trying to add a VECTOR image into word for use as a letterhead template. I don't want a pixel format as this would a) lose definition and b) make the file size large for letter storage. I've tried a PDF format but this seems to pixelate and an eps is just too large a file size.

Any suggestions?

Thanks.

 

[CyberTaz]

It depends on the nature of the image content & what level of print
resolution needed as to which graphic file format would be the best to use
but I would think PNG, JPG or even AI would be fine for most
logos/letterhead.

The big question is "How are you trying to 'add' the image?". If you're
pasting or dragging you're quite likely not going to get the required result
because the image is being converted to little more than a screen shot. Use
Insert> Image> From File & see if it doesn't turn out better.

HTH |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[tmdesign]

Hi Bob - thanks for your reply.
PNG and JPEG are both pixel format though and I want a crisp line which I'd have to go to around 600dpi to be certain of attaining (there's text as well as a line artwork image). This means that I'd end up with a large file size (2Mb plus) - kinda silly for most people's storage!

The same image in line (or AI - Illustrator, PDF, whatever you want to call it) would be a fraction of this... theoretically less than 100K. Does Word simply not have the capability to handle line art for images? Certainly does for text...

 

[MacEvansCB]

Hey: TMDesign .... to do what you want, unfortunately, you will have to upgrade.

I insert PDF and AI files all the time via Insert Image and they retain their vector attributes and look great on screen and print no matter what the resolution. But I am running Mac OS X Leopard v10.5.6 along with Office 2008: Mac.

Inserting PDF and AI files in Office 2004: Mac and earlier and in any version of Windows Office does not work and results in the pixelated low-res image you're seeing. I ran into this at work where I'm on a new iMac and the boss is using a Sony Vaio laptop running Vista/Office 2007.

 

[tmdesign]

Rats. So what you're saying (MacEvans - thanks) is that Microsoft stuffed up... in order to have a letterhead template held in a digital format you have to usesomethingelse because only Office 2008 and Mac Leopard can get a quality letterhead result (at a sensible file size) using Word. Great if everyone were using the same version and OS.

Another great day for Macs!! ;o)

 

[CyberTaz]

Have you tried Illy's Save for MS Office option? It outputs as PNG but may
provide a higher quality than you expect - as well as a significantly
smaller file size & crisper text.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[tmdesign]

Hmmmm... Bob - hadn't seen that. Could be useful. PNG is still a pixel image though and, no, sorry, not nearly crisp enough. (No better than other methods I could use although MUCH quicker.) I need normal printed text clarity. Anything that's anti-aliased will be fuzzy by nature and any pixel image non-aliased would have a heap of jaggies. Does make a good file size though, true enough.

Any more thoughts? I have many clients with digital letterhead requirements and Word would be the common program...

Can I just confirm that Word will not accept ANY vector file? (Other than normal fonts of course).

 

[CyberTaz]

Hello Again-

Sorry the PNG idea didn't work out better - in many cases it does so I'm
surprised you see o difference :-( Perhaps it will be useful for other work.

I don't understand what you mean by "...will not accept ANY vector file".
What would you want to use other than AI, EPS or PNG - all of which Word
will "accept". What may be misleading is that Word 2004 & prior *display*
most any graphic object as a bitmap. If the image is properly inserted,
however, the image should print according to the specs of the embedded file.

The only other suggestion I can offer - although I personally don't care for
the format - is to export the Illy file as EMF. Maybe that will give you the
results you're looking for.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[tmdesign]

Sorry - I should have said IMPORTED/LINKED as a VECTOR rather than accept - files seem to be converted from vector to a format that word can display and print - ie a bitmap. (Is this correct? From what you said "image should print according to the specs of the embedded file" I would presume not.)

Also just for the record "What would you want to use other than AI, EPS or PNG" well PDF would be my preference as it's an industry standard and will incorporate both vector and bitmap elements.

I have double checked and the file DOES NOT print out as the original file (a vector ai) but as a bitmap/pixel image. (Thought... is this printing from the PREVIEW instead?)

I chose: insert>picture>from file... and selected "link to file" without "save with document" (assuming this then forces printing from the original file). (Was this "properly inserted"?) What prints is then a bit mapped image.

Bob - Thanks for your persistence too by the way! )

 

[tmdesign]

Should have said... also tried the EMF but this came back as a corrupted file in Word...

Another oddity which I include just in case it's related: the imported images don't show in anything but edit picture or preview modes.

 

[John McGhie]

Yeah, there's not a good story on this in Word 2004.

I think you need to either go back a version or forward a version, I seem to
remember. I believe PDF works in 2008, provided you stick to .docx file
format.

Effectively, AI is PDF, as is EPS ‹ they all run through the same converter,
and it just doesn't work right in 2004. Goodness knows what persuaded them
they could release a product into the Mac market without the ability to
handle vector images, but there you go

They fixed it in 2008: PDF works very nicely in 2008. So, I just
discovered, does .WMZ and that surprised me: it's quite a rare one.

Sorry about that.

Should have said... also tried the EMF but this came back as a corrupted file
in Word...

Another oddity which I include just in case it's related: the imported images
don't show in anything but edit picture or preview modes.

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Sydney, Australia. mailto:[email protected]

 

[CyberTaz]

If you're linking [rather than embedding] & clearing the checkbox for "Save
with document" the source image is not stored in the document - that's what
"linking" is all about. The doc stores only the bitmap display version plus
a reference to where the source image file is stored. If the source of the
link is not available at the time of printing Word has no choice but to use
only the stored low res version.

The first point to emphasize is that Word cannot *Open* any type of graphic
file format - it can *read* the file & render a displayable *object* which
represents the file's content. Since the display image is "usually" decent
on screen many users think they're seeing the actual image. Therefore -
although I don't know this to be an absolute fact - I firmly believe it to
be best to have a supporting graphics app installed at the time of printing
to act as a background interpreter. I rarely use hi-res images in Word docs,
however so I haven't really pursued the issue extensively.

As to your final point: If you're using the Insert command you're doing it
properly. Which Insert method you specifically use is a matter of preference
& need. My reference was to Insert v. pasting or drag "n" drop.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[CyberTaz]

What version of Illy (I assume) are you using to create the EMF? Older EMFs
can do that - which is one reason I don't prefer them. However, I'm using
CS3 (13.0.2) with no problem inserting EMFs generated from it. In fact I
just tested an older EMF which did generate the "corrupted" message, opened
it in Illy & exported a new EMF which inserted perfectly.

The visibility is most likely due to the Preferences> View settings in Word
combined with the Text Wrapping applied to the images.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[tmdesign]

That said,
IMHO Word has become far too unwieldy a program that has lost sight of it's main reason for existence: Text. Surely most of what it can now do should be done in other apps eg FrontPage, PageMill (or whatever Microsoft's web editor is) or Publisher (which do it far better, more intuitively at most levels, and therefore generally faster for the average user). The myriad of different ways, there are to do something as simple as adding a tab point have made the program mind numbingly frustrating for almost every user of the many I have come in contact with.

A topic for another thread altogether! ;o)

Thank you for you time Bob.

Best wishes,
Tim

 

[Tim Murray]

I have double checked and the file DOES NOT print out as the original file (a

vector ai) but as a bitmap/pixel image. (Thought... is this printing from the

PREVIEW instead?)

Yes: An AI file, in Word, prints the preview. Use EPS.

 

[tmdesign]

Thanks Tim (great name BTW)
Tried an EPS, does the same - prints the bitmap preview. Also (and I'm guessing here) wouldn't some versions of Windows have issues with a postscript file anyhow?

 

[John McGhie]

No, Windows Word works fine with an EPS (although the printer must be
PostScript or have a PS interpreter in its driver). Most office printers
have.

However, I normally produce EPS with a WMF preview: that way if the document
is sent to a non-postscript printer that does not have a PostScript
interpreter, it does print the preview instead, but the preview is also a
vector

I am not sure this works with Word 2004.

Sorry.

Thanks Tim (great name BTW)
Tried an EPS, does the same - prints the bitmap preview. Also (and I'm
guessing here) wouldn't some versions of Windows have issues with a postscript
file anyhow?

--
Don't wait for your answer, click here: http://www.word.mvps.org/

Please reply in the group. Please do NOT email me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie, Microsoft MVP, Word and Word:Mac
Sydney, Australia. mailto:[email protected]