Caption problems for pictures

[john]

Hi

I copied and pasted a picture into a Word for Mac 2004 v11.3 document
for a book, aligned it how I wanted it, inserted Caption, which I set
for automatic numbering (Numbered level for chapter, eg. Fig 3.1), and
this worked fine for the first two pictures. However, when I tried
this a third time for the same chapter the Caption appeared as a text
box that:
(a) had a border;
(b) wasn't anchored to the picture, so that when I moved the picture,
the Caption stayed where it was.

Even when I highligted the text box, went to Format, and selected No
Borders, this didn't eliminate the border.

The only diffference is that the first two pictures that I pasted in
and that worked were .jpg files and the subsequent ones were .tiff
files, but I did use Paste Special and paste them as Pictures.

I've tried everything I know. I followed all the Help instructions
for Captions, but to no avail. I'm using an iMac Intel Duo with OSX
10.4.8.

Extremely grateful for advice

John

 

[Daiya Mitchell]

Hi John,

It depends on the Layout setting for the picture and whether it is
floating or in-line with text. When you double-click an image to bring
up the Format Picture dialog, 4 of the 5 wrapping options create
floating graphics--square, tight, behind text, in front of text. I have
no idea what controls whether pictures are pasted in as inline or floating.

MVP Suzanne Barnhill wrote:
"Probably you know that graphics can be inserted either "In Line with Text"
(in the text layer) or "wrapped" ("floating," in the drawing layer). When
you select an inline graphic and use Insert | Caption (or Insert |
Reference
| Caption), you get a caption that is plain text (in the Caption style). If
you select a wrapped graphic, you get a caption that is in a text box."

She suggests keeping all graphics Inline with Text to prevent this. "If
you need text to wrap around your graphic, select both the inline
graphic and its plain-text caption and insert both in a frame, then wrap
the text around the frame."

Taken from this thread, where there is some other general advice about
keeping captions with images, but the guy is dealing with a different
problem.
<http://groups.google.com/group/micr...dd383844c29?lnk=st&q=&rnum=4#89a21dd383844c29>

I hope that helps--not knowing your document, it's not completely clear
what your best option would be, but ideally that gives you the
information you need to fix it. If not, post back.

Daiya

 

[CyberTaz]

<snip>

I have no idea what controls whether pictures are pasted in as inline or

floating.
<snip>

In Line is the default setting in 2004 & unlike PC Word 2003 there is no
option to change it. However, it is also dependent on the nature of the
copied object. If, for example, you copy an object which has Text Wrapping
applied that property is retained when you paste it in.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[john]

Daiya and Bob

Very many thanks.

If I select Inline with Text, and then Insert Caption, this does
indeed produce a caption below the picture, and the numbering of the
caption is correct (when the Text Box caption numbering is
inconsistent as well as having borders when it shouldn't and not being
anchored to the picture).

But still some problems:

(a) When I paste in the picture, and then double-click, the layout
HASN'T defaulted to Inline with text, but to Horizontal
Alignment>Other, and so I have to change this manually.
(b) It also defaults to Text Box Caption with border (and aberrant
number), and so I have to delete this caption and then Insert Caption
to produce your suggested caption (with correct numbering).
(c) This caption is still not anchored to the picture.
1. If I select the picture and change its alignment on the formatting
palette to Centre (rather than its default of Left), the caption stays
where it is, Left aligned
2. If I move the picture down, the caption stays where it is and a
new, untitled caption with the next number appears beneath the picture
in its new position.

Bob, I'm not copying an object with text wrapping, but a picture.

What I want all the pictures to do is display centred and have a
consistently numbered caption beneath it, and if I move the picture or
insert another later, for the the numbering to follow its position in
the text.

How can I do this without having to go through all these manual steps
every time I insert a picture?

Many thanks

John

 

[John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]]

Hi John:

You need to make a choice of Inline or Floating up front when using
pictures. I always use inline, never floating.

So I create a paragraph style named "Picture" which I set to the required
positioning properties (in your case, Centred) and apply Keep With Next.

I then create a paragraph in that style and paste or insert the picture onto
it. The picture is then automatically positioned and offset to a consistent
measurement.

I then hit Enter, to give me a following paragraph and insert the caption.
Make sure the Caption style is set to Keep Lines Together, otherwise it
might split at the bottom of the page. The Keep With Next on the Picture
style holds the two together.

If you use a floating picture, Word automatically encases the caption in a
text box so it can float too. This breaks the ability to produce a list of
Figures: anything in a text box is invisible to the TOC generator.

If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption enabled, you will always get the
unwanted text box.

This is yet another example of hidden, automatically-stuff-up-your-document
IntelliNonsense racing ahead leaving the user totally out of control and
unable to recover. It's just design bugs: sorry. Once you turn off all the
automatic rubbish designed to impress newbies, the mechanism works quite
well.

I use a macro to do it all for me: it opens a selection window to choose the
graphic and automatically resizes the graphic so all graphics are a
consistent size.

Cheers

Daiya and Bob

Very many thanks.

If I select Inline with Text, and then Insert Caption, this does
indeed produce a caption below the picture, and the numbering of the
caption is correct (when the Text Box caption numbering is
inconsistent as well as having borders when it shouldn't and not being
anchored to the picture).

But still some problems:

(a) When I paste in the picture, and then double-click, the layout
HASN'T defaulted to Inline with text, but to Horizontal
Alignment>Other, and so I have to change this manually.
(b) It also defaults to Text Box Caption with border (and aberrant
number), and so I have to delete this caption and then Insert Caption
to produce your suggested caption (with correct numbering).
(c) This caption is still not anchored to the picture.
1. If I select the picture and change its alignment on the formatting
palette to Centre (rather than its default of Left), the caption stays
where it is, Left aligned
2. If I move the picture down, the caption stays where it is and a
new, untitled caption with the next number appears beneath the picture
in its new position.

Bob, I'm not copying an object with text wrapping, but a picture.

What I want all the pictures to do is display centred and have a
consistently numbered caption beneath it, and if I move the picture or
insert another later, for the the numbering to follow its position in
the text.

How can I do this without having to go through all these manual steps
every time I insert a picture?

Many thanks

John

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

 

[CyberTaz]

Hi John -

My post was more in response to Daiya's quite atypical uncertainty, but just
for further clarification...

<snip>

Bob, I'm not copying an object with text wrapping, but a picture.

<snip>

A picture _is_ an object, as are tables, AutoShapes, Word Art, etc. Whether
it has Text Wrapping applied depends on what it is you are copy/pasting &
where you're copying from. OTOH, if you use the Insert>Picture>From File
command the object (picture) will be inserted In Line by default.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[john]

Hi John & everybody

This is extremely helpful, especially to understand why the MS Help
links didn't help me. However, I have found some problems trying to
follow what seems an excellent routine:

1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption.
I double clicked on the picture and the Format Picture showed a
default of Horizontal alignment > Other.
Hence I had to select Inline with text and delete the text box,
before inserting a non-text-box caption. How do I change the default
to Inline?

2. After I had produced an Inline picture in a paragraph styled to
Keep with Next, and the next resulted from Insert>Caption (no text
box) and then I moved the picture, the Caption didn't move with it.
What did I do wrong?

Many thanks

John

 

[john]

Thanks, Bob, for explaining this. But I'm still left with a problem:
see reply to John.

John

 

[john]

Hi John

I'm afraid this doesn't answer my post number 6 of 19 Feb. I didn't
use "Insert>Caption>AutoCaption > enabled"

More importantly, you say that Word for Mac will past everything as
Inline.

What my earlier posting said was:
"1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption," which is the opposite of what you say.

I'll be grateful if you check my posting number 6 and answer the two
questions.

With kindest regards

John

 

[John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]]

Hi John:

Sorry, I didn't do so well there, did I? I thought Word always pasted
inline as the default.

It seems I was wrong: Word 2004 seems to paste pictures *with the layout
they had when they were copied*. I thought they always pasted inline
because all my pictures are in line, so I will always copy inline and thus
always paste inline.

However I just set one to Floating and copied it: it pasted as floating. So
I was wrong: "It pastes the way it copied".

However, the important part of my previous statement is:
"There's no way to control that." Unfortunately, THAT statement is not
subject to update -- Mac Word lacks the preference that enables you to set a
default pasting layout for pictures.

The other thing, which I should have made more clear, is that if the picture
is floating, its caption MUST be floating so that the caption can move with
the picture. If you don't want floating captions (and I would never want
them...) then you have to ensure the picture is NOT floating before creating
the caption. If you have AutoCaption switched ON, you need to switch that
OFF otherwise you won't get a chance to set the picture to inline before
creating the caption.

I don't use AutoCaption, and I don't like living in a lottery as to what I
will get, so I always create the paragraph for the caption before I use
Insert Caption. If the insertion point is in a paragraph, and the picture
is not selected, before you insert the caption, then the caption will be
created inline every time. I know what I am going to get

So that's the other way of working: Paste your picture, then hit Enter
before Insert>Caption.

Taking the line off a text box is easy once you have selected the text box.
But selecting a text box is not easy!

It is extremely difficult to see whether you have selected the "text box" or
the "text within the text box".

1) The FIRST click on the text box SHOULD select the text box itself,
provided you click on the edge of it. If you click inside the text box, you
will select the text.

2) The second click should select the text inside it.

The only way to tell is to examine the border around the selected text box.
If the border is composed of "dots" the text box object is selected and you
can remove the border. If the border around appears as "lines" you have
selected the text and the border controls are not available.

Once you have the text box selected with its border showing as dots, then
you can use Format>Text Box>Colours and Lines to set the border to "No
Line".

Not the greatest piece of UI design, is it...

Hope this helps

Hi John

I'm afraid this doesn't answer my post number 6 of 19 Feb. I didn't
use "Insert>Caption>AutoCaption > enabled"

More importantly, you say that Word for Mac will past everything as
Inline.

What my earlier posting said was:
"1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption," which is the opposite of what you say.

I'll be grateful if you check my posting number 6 and answer the two
questions.

With kindest regards

John

Hi John:

As I said in my earlier reply "If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption
enabled, you will always get the unwanted text box." To change that, see
the Word Help topic "Automatically add captions to tables, figures,
equations, or other items".

Word on the Mac has no ability to set the default wrapping style for pasting
pictures: it will paste everything as Inline. Sorry about that

Hope this helps

Hi John & everybody

This is extremely helpful, especially to understand why the MS Help
links didn't help me. However, I have found some problems trying to
follow what seems an excellent routine:

1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption.
I double clicked on the picture and the Format Picture showed a
default of Horizontal alignment > Other.
Hence I had to select Inline with text and delete the text box,
before inserting a non-text-box caption. How do I change the default
to Inline?

2. After I had produced an Inline picture in a paragraph styled to
Keep with Next, and the next resulted from Insert>Caption (no text
box) and then I moved the picture, the Caption didn't move with it.
What did I do wrong?

Many thanks

John

On Feb 18, 10:50 pm, "John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]"
Hi John:

You need to make a choice of Inline or Floating up front when using
pictures. I always use inline, never floating.

So I create a paragraph style named "Picture" which I set to the required
positioning properties (in your case, Centred) and apply Keep With Next.

I then create a paragraph in that style and paste or insert the picture
onto
it. The picture is then automatically positioned and offset to a
consistent
measurement.

I then hit Enter, to give me a following paragraph and insert the caption.
Make sure the Caption style is set to Keep Lines Together, otherwise it
might split at the bottom of the page. The Keep With Next on the Picture
style holds the two together.

If you use a floating picture, Word automatically encases the caption in a
text box so it can float too. This breaks the ability to produce a list of
Figures: anything in a text box is invisible to the TOC generator.

If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption enabled, you will always get the
unwanted text box.

This is yet another example of hidden, automatically-stuff-up-your-document
IntelliNonsense racing ahead leaving the user totally out of control and
unable to recover. It's just design bugs: sorry. Once you turn off all
the
automatic rubbish designed to impress newbies, the mechanism works quite
well.

I use a macro to do it all for me: it opens a selection window to choose
the
graphic and automatically resizes the graphic so all graphics are a
consistent size.

On 19/2/07 9:10 AM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "(e-mail address removed)"

Daiya and Bob

Very many thanks.

If I select Inline with Text, and then Insert Caption, this does
indeed produce a caption below the picture, and the numbering of the
caption is correct (when the Text Box caption numbering is
inconsistent as well as having borders when it shouldn't and not being
anchored to the picture).

But still some problems:

(a) When I paste in the picture, and then double-click, the layout
HASN'T defaulted to Inline with text, but to Horizontal
Alignment>Other, and so I have to change this manually.
(b) It also defaults to Text Box Caption with border (and aberrant
number), and so I have to delete this caption and then Insert Caption
to produce your suggested caption (with correct numbering).
(c) This caption is still not anchored to the picture.
1. If I select the picture and change its alignment on the formatting
palette to Centre (rather than its default of Left), the caption stays
where it is, Left aligned
2. If I move the picture down, the caption stays where it is and a
new, untitled caption with the next number appears beneath the picture
in its new position.

Bob, I'm not copying an object with text wrapping, but a picture.

What I want all the pictures to do is display centred and have a
consistently numbered caption beneath it, and if I move the picture or
insert another later, for the the numbering to follow its position in
the text.

How can I do this without having to go through all these manual steps
every time I insert a picture?

Many thanks

<snip>

On 2/18/07 1:09 PM, in article [email protected],
"Daiya

I have no idea what controls whether pictures are pasted in as inline or

In Line is the default setting in 2004 & unlike PC Word 2003 there is no
option to change it. However, it is also dependent on the nature of the
copied object. If, for example, you copy an object which has Text
Wrapping
applied that property is retained when you paste it in.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

 

[john]

Hi John

I now understand that Word 2004 pastes pictures with the layout when
they were copied, that the default can't be changed, and that it is
better to switch off AutoCaption. Accordingly I've changd all my
pictures to Inline and switched off AutoCaption as you recommend.

But this still doesn't answer Question 2 of my Post number 6. (This
happens both with Inline pictures and Floating pictures.)

As I asked in Post 4, what I want all the pictures to do is display
centred and have a consistently numbered caption (also centred)
beneath it, and if a move the picture then the caption follows it, and
if it moves below another picture, for the caption number to change
reflect the new order of pictures.

Many thanks

John

Hi John:

Sorry, I didn't do so well there, did I? I thought Word always pasted
inline as the default.

It seems I was wrong: Word 2004 seems to paste pictures *with the layout
they had when they were copied*. I thought they always pasted inline
because all my pictures are in line, so I will always copy inline and thus
always paste inline.

However I just set one to Floating and copied it: it pasted as floating. So
I was wrong: "It pastes the way it copied".

However, the important part of my previous statement is:
"There's no way to control that." Unfortunately, THAT statement is not
subject to update -- Mac Word lacks the preference that enables you to set a
default pasting layout for pictures.

The other thing, which I should have made more clear, is that if the picture
is floating, its caption MUST be floating so that the caption can move with
the picture. If you don't want floating captions (and I would never want
them...) then you have to ensure the picture is NOT floating before creating
the caption. If you have AutoCaption switched ON, you need to switch that
OFF otherwise you won't get a chance to set the picture to inline before
creating the caption.

I don't use AutoCaption, and I don't like living in a lottery as to what I
will get, so I always create the paragraph for the caption before I use
Insert Caption. If the insertion point is in a paragraph, and the picture
is not selected, before you insert the caption, then the caption will be
created inline every time. I know what I am going to get

So that's the other way of working: Paste your picture, then hit Enter
before Insert>Caption.

Taking the line off a text box is easy once you have selected the text box.
But selecting a text box is not easy!

It is extremely difficult to see whether you have selected the "text box"or
the "text within the text box".

1) The FIRST click on the text box SHOULD select the text box itself,
provided you click on the edge of it. If you click inside the text box, you
will select the text.

2) The second click should select the text inside it.

The only way to tell is to examine the border around the selected text box.
If the border is composed of "dots" the text box object is selected and you
can remove the border. If the border around appears as "lines" you have
selected the text and the border controls are not available.

Once you have the text box selected with its border showing as dots, then
you can use Format>Text Box>Colours and Lines to set the border to "No
Line".

Not the greatest piece of UI design, is it...

Hope this helps

Hi John

I'm afraid this doesn't answer my post number 6 of 19 Feb. I didn't
use "Insert>Caption>AutoCaption > enabled"

More importantly, you say that Word for Mac will past everything as
Inline.

What my earlier posting said was:
"1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption," which is the opposite of what you say.

I'll be grateful if you check my posting number 6 and answer the two
questions.

With kindest regards

John

Hi John:
As I said in my earlier reply "If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption
enabled, you will always get the unwanted text box." To change that, see
the Word Help topic "Automatically add captions to tables, figures,
equations, or other items".
Word on the Mac has no ability to set the default wrapping style for pasting
pictures: it will paste everything as Inline. Sorry about that
Hope this helps
On 20/2/07 9:57 AM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "[email protected]"
Hi John & everybody
This is extremely helpful, especially to understand why the MS Help
links didn't help me. However, I have found some problems trying to
follow what seems an excellent routine:
1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption.
I double clicked on the picture and the Format Picture showed a
default of Horizontal alignment > Other.
Hence I had to select Inline with text and delete the text box,
before inserting a non-text-box caption. How do I change the default
to Inline?
2. After I had produced an Inline picture in a paragraph styled to
Keep with Next, and the next resulted from Insert>Caption (no text
box) and then I moved the picture, the Caption didn't move with it.
What did I do wrong?
Many thanks
John
On Feb 18, 10:50 pm, "John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]"
Hi John:
You need to make a choice of Inline or Floating up front when using
pictures. I always use inline, never floating.
So I create a paragraph style named "Picture" which I set to the required
positioning properties (in your case, Centred) and apply Keep With Next.
I then create a paragraph in that style and paste or insert the picture
onto
it. The picture is then automatically positioned and offset to a
consistent
measurement.
I then hit Enter, to give me a following paragraph and insert the caption.
Make sure the Caption style is set to Keep Lines Together, otherwiseit
might split at the bottom of the page. The Keep With Next on the Picture
style holds the two together.
If you use a floating picture, Word automatically encases the caption in a
text box so it can float too. This breaks the ability to produce a list of
Figures: anything in a text box is invisible to the TOC generator.
If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption enabled, you will always get the
unwanted text box.
This is yet another example of hidden, automatically-stuff-up-your-document
IntelliNonsense racing ahead leaving the user totally out of controland
unable to recover. It's just design bugs: sorry. Once you turn offall
the
automatic rubbish designed to impress newbies, the mechanism works quite
well.
I use a macro to do it all for me: it opens a selection window to choose
the
graphic and automatically resizes the graphic so all graphics are a
consistent size.
Cheers
On 19/2/07 9:10 AM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "(e-mail address removed)"
Daiya and Bob
Very many thanks.
If I select Inline with Text, and then Insert Caption, this does
indeed produce a caption below the picture, and the numbering of the
caption is correct (when the Text Box caption numbering is
inconsistent as well as having borders when it shouldn't and not being
anchored to the picture).
But still some problems:
(a) When I paste in the picture, and then double-click, the layout
HASN'T defaulted to Inline with text, but to Horizontal
Alignment>Other, and so I have to change this manually.
(b) It also defaults to Text Box Caption with border (and aberrant
number), and so I have to delete this caption and then Insert Caption
to produce your suggested caption (with correct numbering).
(c) This caption is still not anchored to the picture.
1. If I select the picture and change its alignment on the formatting
palette to Centre (rather than its default of Left), the caption stays
where it is, Left aligned
2. If I move the picture down, the caption stays where it is and a
new, untitled caption with the next number appears beneath the picture
in its new position.
Bob, I'm not copying an object with text wrapping, but a picture.
What I want all the pictures to do is display centred and have a
consistently numbered caption beneath it, and if I move the pictureor
insert another later, for the the numbering to follow its position in
the text.
How can I do this without having to go through all these manual steps
every time I insert a picture?
Many thanks
John
<snip>
On 2/18/07 1:09 PM, in article [email protected],
"Daiya
I have no idea what controls whether pictures are pasted in as inline or
floating.
<snip>
In Line is the default setting in 2004 & unlike PC Word 2003 thereis no
option to change it. However, it is also dependent on the nature of the
copied object. If, for example, you copy an object which has Text
Wrapping
applied that property is retained when you paste it in.
Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac
--
Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do notemail
me unless I ask you to.
John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410
--
Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.
John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and ...

read more »

 

[Daiya Mitchell]

Hi John,

I have no idea which your post #6 is, as the interface I use does not
have the numbers (ditto for John McGhie), but if this is your still
unanswered question:

2. After I had produced an Inline picture in a paragraph styled to
Keep with Next, and the next resulted from Insert>Caption (no text
box) and then I moved the picture, the Caption didn't move with it.
What did I do wrong?

I don't think you did anything wrong. The Caption and the Picture are
two separate entities. They won't move together unless you select them
both and move them. The "keep with next" setting that is applied to the
Picture will prevent Word from breaking a page right after the picture,
leaving the caption orphaned. It doesn't make them move together.

If selecting them both is really too much trouble, you could put them
both in a frame. But I think frames are a lot of trouble.

The caption number should update when you Update Fields.

I'm not clear on the status of your questions, so if something is still
unanswered, please ask it again.

Daiya

Hi John

I now understand that Word 2004 pastes pictures with the layout when
they were copied, that the default can't be changed, and that it is
better to switch off AutoCaption. Accordingly I've changd all my
pictures to Inline and switched off AutoCaption as you recommend.

But this still doesn't answer Question 2 of my Post number 6. (This
happens both with Inline pictures and Floating pictures.)

As I asked in Post 4, what I want all the pictures to do is display
centred and have a consistently numbered caption (also centred)
beneath it, and if a move the picture then the caption follows it, and
if it moves below another picture, for the caption number to change
reflect the new order of pictures.

Many thanks

John

Hi John:

Sorry, I didn't do so well there, did I? I thought Word always pasted
inline as the default.

It seems I was wrong: Word 2004 seems to paste pictures *with the layout
they had when they were copied*. I thought they always pasted inline
because all my pictures are in line, so I will always copy inline and thus
always paste inline.

However I just set one to Floating and copied it: it pasted as floating. So
I was wrong: "It pastes the way it copied".

However, the important part of my previous statement is:
"There's no way to control that." Unfortunately, THAT statement is not
subject to update -- Mac Word lacks the preference that enables you to set a
default pasting layout for pictures.

The other thing, which I should have made more clear, is that if the picture
is floating, its caption MUST be floating so that the caption can move with
the picture. If you don't want floating captions (and I would never want
them...) then you have to ensure the picture is NOT floating before creating
the caption. If you have AutoCaption switched ON, you need to switch that
OFF otherwise you won't get a chance to set the picture to inline before
creating the caption.

I don't use AutoCaption, and I don't like living in a lottery as to what I
will get, so I always create the paragraph for the caption before I use
Insert Caption. If the insertion point is in a paragraph, and the picture
is not selected, before you insert the caption, then the caption will be
created inline every time. I know what I am going to get

So that's the other way of working: Paste your picture, then hit Enter
before Insert>Caption.

Taking the line off a text box is easy once you have selected the text box.
But selecting a text box is not easy!

It is extremely difficult to see whether you have selected the "text box" or
the "text within the text box".

1) The FIRST click on the text box SHOULD select the text box itself,
provided you click on the edge of it. If you click inside the text box, you
will select the text.

2) The second click should select the text inside it.

The only way to tell is to examine the border around the selected text box.
If the border is composed of "dots" the text box object is selected and you
can remove the border. If the border around appears as "lines" you have
selected the text and the border controls are not available.

Once you have the text box selected with its border showing as dots, then
you can use Format>Text Box>Colours and Lines to set the border to "No
Line".

Not the greatest piece of UI design, is it...

Hope this helps

Hi John

I'm afraid this doesn't answer my post number 6 of 19 Feb. I didn't
use "Insert>Caption>AutoCaption > enabled"

More importantly, you say that Word for Mac will past everything as
Inline.

What my earlier posting said was:
"1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption," which is the opposite of what you say.

I'll be grateful if you check my posting number 6 and answer the two
questions.

With kindest regards

John

On Feb 21, 12:34 pm, "John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]"

Hi John:

As I said in my earlier reply "If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption
enabled, you will always get the unwanted text box." To change that, see
the Word Help topic "Automatically add captions to tables, figures,
equations, or other items".

Word on the Mac has no ability to set the default wrapping style for pasting
pictures: it will paste everything as Inline. Sorry about that

Hope this helps

On 20/2/07 9:57 AM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "[email protected]"


Hi John & everybody

This is extremely helpful, especially to understand why the MS Help
links didn't help me. However, I have found some problems trying to
follow what seems an excellent routine:

1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption.
I double clicked on the picture and the Format Picture showed a
default of Horizontal alignment > Other.
Hence I had to select Inline with text and delete the text box,
before inserting a non-text-box caption. How do I change the default
to Inline?

2. After I had produced an Inline picture in a paragraph styled to
Keep with Next, and the next resulted from Insert>Caption (no text
box) and then I moved the picture, the Caption didn't move with it.
What did I do wrong?

Many thanks

John

On Feb 18, 10:50 pm, "John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]"

Hi John:

You need to make a choice of Inline or Floating up front when using
pictures. I always use inline, never floating.

So I create a paragraph style named "Picture" which I set to the required
positioning properties (in your case, Centred) and apply Keep With Next.

I then create a paragraph in that style and paste or insert the picture
onto
it. The picture is then automatically positioned and offset to a
consistent
measurement.

I then hit Enter, to give me a following paragraph and insert the caption.
Make sure the Caption style is set to Keep Lines Together, otherwise it
might split at the bottom of the page. The Keep With Next on the Picture
style holds the two together.

If you use a floating picture, Word automatically encases the caption in a
text box so it can float too. This breaks the ability to produce a list of
Figures: anything in a text box is invisible to the TOC generator.

If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption enabled, you will always get the
unwanted text box.

This is yet another example of hidden, automatically-stuff-up-your-document
IntelliNonsense racing ahead leaving the user totally out of control and
unable to recover. It's just design bugs: sorry. Once you turn off all
the
automatic rubbish designed to impress newbies, the mechanism works quite
well.

I use a macro to do it all for me: it opens a selection window to choose
the
graphic and automatically resizes the graphic so all graphics are a
consistent size.

Cheers

On 19/2/07 9:10 AM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "(e-mail address removed)"


Daiya and Bob

Very many thanks.

If I select Inline with Text, and then Insert Caption, this does
indeed produce a caption below the picture, and the numbering of the
caption is correct (when the Text Box caption numbering is
inconsistent as well as having borders when it shouldn't and not being
anchored to the picture).

But still some problems:

(a) When I paste in the picture, and then double-click, the layout
HASN'T defaulted to Inline with text, but to Horizontal
Alignment>Other, and so I have to change this manually.
(b) It also defaults to Text Box Caption with border (and aberrant
number), and so I have to delete this caption and then Insert Caption
to produce your suggested caption (with correct numbering).
(c) This caption is still not anchored to the picture.
1. If I select the picture and change its alignment on the formatting
palette to Centre (rather than its default of Left), the caption stays
where it is, Left aligned
2. If I move the picture down, the caption stays where it is and a
new, untitled caption with the next number appears beneath the picture
in its new position.

Bob, I'm not copying an object with text wrapping, but a picture.

What I want all the pictures to do is display centred and have a
consistently numbered caption beneath it, and if I move the picture or
insert another later, for the the numbering to follow its position in
the text.

How can I do this without having to go through all these manual steps
every time I insert a picture?

Many thanks

John


<snip>

On 2/18/07 1:09 PM, in article [email protected],
"Daiya


I have no idea what controls whether pictures are pasted in as inline or

floating.
<snip>

In Line is the default setting in 2004 & unlike PC Word 2003 there is no
option to change it. However, it is also dependent on the nature of the
copied object. If, for example, you copy an object which has Text
Wrapping
applied that property is retained when you paste it in.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and ...

read more »

 

[John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]]

Hi John:

Yeah, I'm lost too The Google interface you are using carries the
messages in a different order from the Microsoft web interface some of us
use, the web scraper interfaces others use, and the NNTP newsreaders most of
the MVPs use.

However, in one of my earlier posts (!) I explained that I put each picture
on a paragraph of its own, set inline.

I put each caption on a paragraph of its own, set inline.

I then use styles to position the paragraphs (and thus, the pictures and
captions) as I want them.

It is important to use the Keep With Next property in the style for the
picture paragraph, to force it to follow the Caption paragraph to a new page
if necessary.

It is essential that the Caption style have the Keep Lines Together property
to prevent it splitting at the bottom of a page, otherwise the previous
property cannot work.

If you must persist with floating pictures and captions, then use the
Drawing facility to "Group" the picture with its caption. It won't work
perfectly, and makes for troublesome document maintenance, which is why I
don't use that method.

Cheers

Hi John

I now understand that Word 2004 pastes pictures with the layout when
they were copied, that the default can't be changed, and that it is
better to switch off AutoCaption. Accordingly I've changd all my
pictures to Inline and switched off AutoCaption as you recommend.

But this still doesn't answer Question 2 of my Post number 6. (This
happens both with Inline pictures and Floating pictures.)

As I asked in Post 4, what I want all the pictures to do is display
centred and have a consistently numbered caption (also centred)
beneath it, and if a move the picture then the caption follows it, and
if it moves below another picture, for the caption number to change
reflect the new order of pictures.

Many thanks

John

Hi John:

Sorry, I didn't do so well there, did I? I thought Word always pasted
inline as the default.

It seems I was wrong: Word 2004 seems to paste pictures *with the layout
they had when they were copied*. I thought they always pasted inline
because all my pictures are in line, so I will always copy inline and thus
always paste inline.

However I just set one to Floating and copied it: it pasted as floating. So
I was wrong: "It pastes the way it copied".

However, the important part of my previous statement is:
"There's no way to control that." Unfortunately, THAT statement is not
subject to update -- Mac Word lacks the preference that enables you to set a
default pasting layout for pictures.

The other thing, which I should have made more clear, is that if the picture
is floating, its caption MUST be floating so that the caption can move with
the picture. If you don't want floating captions (and I would never want
them...) then you have to ensure the picture is NOT floating before creating
the caption. If you have AutoCaption switched ON, you need to switch that
OFF otherwise you won't get a chance to set the picture to inline before
creating the caption.

I don't use AutoCaption, and I don't like living in a lottery as to what I
will get, so I always create the paragraph for the caption before I use
Insert Caption. If the insertion point is in a paragraph, and the picture
is not selected, before you insert the caption, then the caption will be
created inline every time. I know what I am going to get

So that's the other way of working: Paste your picture, then hit Enter
before Insert>Caption.

Taking the line off a text box is easy once you have selected the text box.
But selecting a text box is not easy!

It is extremely difficult to see whether you have selected the "text box" or
the "text within the text box".

1) The FIRST click on the text box SHOULD select the text box itself,
provided you click on the edge of it. If you click inside the text box, you
will select the text.

2) The second click should select the text inside it.

The only way to tell is to examine the border around the selected text box.
If the border is composed of "dots" the text box object is selected and you
can remove the border. If the border around appears as "lines" you have
selected the text and the border controls are not available.

Once you have the text box selected with its border showing as dots, then
you can use Format>Text Box>Colours and Lines to set the border to "No
Line".

Not the greatest piece of UI design, is it...

Hope this helps

Hi John

I'm afraid this doesn't answer my post number 6 of 19 Feb. I didn't
use "Insert>Caption>AutoCaption > enabled"

More importantly, you say that Word for Mac will past everything as
Inline.

What my earlier posting said was:
"1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption," which is the opposite of what you say.

I'll be grateful if you check my posting number 6 and answer the two
questions.

With kindest regards

John

On Feb 21, 12:34 pm, "John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]"
Hi John:

As I said in my earlier reply "If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption
enabled, you will always get the unwanted text box." To change that, see
the Word Help topic "Automatically add captions to tables, figures,
equations, or other items".

Word on the Mac has no ability to set the default wrapping style for
pasting
pictures: it will paste everything as Inline. Sorry about that

Hope this helps

On 20/2/07 9:57 AM, in article
(e-mail address removed), "(e-mail address removed)"

Hi John & everybody

This is extremely helpful, especially to understand why the MS Help
links didn't help me. However, I have found some problems trying to
follow what seems an excellent routine:

1. When I copied in a picture it defaulted to a floating format with
an automatic text box Caption.
I double clicked on the picture and the Format Picture showed a
default of Horizontal alignment > Other.
Hence I had to select Inline with text and delete the text box,
before inserting a non-text-box caption. How do I change the default
to Inline?

2. After I had produced an Inline picture in a paragraph styled to
Keep with Next, and the next resulted from Insert>Caption (no text
box) and then I moved the picture, the Caption didn't move with it.
What did I do wrong?

Many thanks

John

On Feb 18, 10:50 pm, "John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]"
Hi John:

You need to make a choice of Inline or Floating up front when using
pictures. I always use inline, never floating.

So I create a paragraph style named "Picture" which I set to the required
positioning properties (in your case, Centred) and apply Keep With Next.

I then create a paragraph in that style and paste or insert the picture
onto
it. The picture is then automatically positioned and offset to a
consistent
measurement.

I then hit Enter, to give me a following paragraph and insert the
caption.
Make sure the Caption style is set to Keep Lines Together, otherwise it
might split at the bottom of the page. The Keep With Next on the Picture
style holds the two together.

If you use a floating picture, Word automatically encases the caption in
a
text box so it can float too. This breaks the ability to produce a list
of
Figures: anything in a text box is invisible to the TOC generator.

If you have Insert>Caption>AutoCaption enabled, you will always get the
unwanted text box.

This is yet another example of hidden,
automatically-stuff-up-your-document
IntelliNonsense racing ahead leaving the user totally out of control and
unable to recover. It's just design bugs: sorry. Once you turn off all
the
automatic rubbish designed to impress newbies, the mechanism works quite
well.

I use a macro to do it all for me: it opens a selection window to choose
the
graphic and automatically resizes the graphic so all graphics are a
consistent size.

On 19/2/07 9:10 AM, in article
(e-mail address removed),
"(e-mail address removed)"

Daiya and Bob

Very many thanks.

If I select Inline with Text, and then Insert Caption, this does
indeed produce a caption below the picture, and the numbering of the
caption is correct (when the Text Box caption numbering is
inconsistent as well as having borders when it shouldn't and not being
anchored to the picture).

But still some problems:

(a) When I paste in the picture, and then double-click, the layout
HASN'T defaulted to Inline with text, but to Horizontal
Alignment>Other, and so I have to change this manually.
(b) It also defaults to Text Box Caption with border (and aberrant
number), and so I have to delete this caption and then Insert Caption
to produce your suggested caption (with correct numbering).
(c) This caption is still not anchored to the picture.
1. If I select the picture and change its alignment on the formatting
palette to Centre (rather than its default of Left), the caption stays
where it is, Left aligned
2. If I move the picture down, the caption stays where it is and a
new, untitled caption with the next number appears beneath the picture
in its new position.

Bob, I'm not copying an object with text wrapping, but a picture.

What I want all the pictures to do is display centred and have a
consistently numbered caption beneath it, and if I move the picture or
insert another later, for the the numbering to follow its position in
the text.

How can I do this without having to go through all these manual steps
every time I insert a picture?

Many thanks

<snip>

On 2/18/07 1:09 PM, in article [email protected],
"Daiya

I have no idea what controls whether pictures are pasted in as inline
or

In Line is the default setting in 2004 & unlike PC Word 2003 there is
no
option to change it. However, it is also dependent on the nature of the
copied object. If, for example, you copy an object which has Text
Wrapping
applied that property is retained when you paste it in.

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not
email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and ...

read more »

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

 

[CyberTaz]

Hi John -

Let me stick my nose in once again

As I asked in Post 4, what I want all the pictures to do is display
centred and have a consistently numbered caption (also centred)
beneath it,

Centering is an attribute of the paragraph containing the picture as well as
the one containing the caption. To have them centered it is necessary to
apply center alignment to each, either directly or by way of a Style. IOW,
neither the graphic nor the caption (text) can have center alignment applied
to *them*, nor can they "carry it along" if you move them. They become a
part of the para you move them to & will be aligned according to the
formatting of that para. So...

and if a move the picture then the caption follows it, and
if it moves below another picture, for the caption number to change
reflect the new order of pictures.

Two points here: If you need to move an image with its caption while
retaining center alignment it is best to select both paras & move them at
the same time - just as though they were 2 consecutive paras of text. I get
the impression that you have been deceived by the "Keep with Next"
terminology. It doesn't create a permanent bonding of those two specific
paras. It simply tells the program that if a page break, column break or
section break occurs that the paragraph to which it is applied should not
get separated from the one that follows it - _whatever_ following para it
happens to be at the time.

The second point is that the caption fields don't automatically update when
you rearrange them. Only Footnotes, Endnotes & Bookmarks do. If the order
changes & you want to see the update take place immediately, Command-Click
the caption number & select Update Field.

HTH |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[john]

Dear Daiya, John, & Bob

Very many thanks for clarifications.

I had misunderstood John's previous advice and was under the
impression that it made the caption anchored to the picture. (An icon
of an anchor appears at the bottom LH corner of the picture, but I've
no idea what it means.)

I was also under the impression that the caption automatically updated
its numbering if was moved.

Just so that I understand correctly this time, am I right in thinking
that the best plan is:

1. Change all my pictures to Inline and switch off AutoCaption.
2. Create para style Diagram, which is Centred and Keep with Next.
3. Copy picture into this para.
4. Create caption.

If move:

5. Select both picture and caption, and then move both together
6. Control-Click Caption Number and Select "Update Field"

Very many thanks

John

 

[CyberTaz]

By Jove, I think he's got it!!!

Yessir - I know it sounds a little "unintuitive" - especially since MS
blesses us with 'floating' graphics capability, but John's approach when
dealing with a large number/long doc is quite sound.

Floaters are fine in short docs and/or if kept to a minimum, as long as you
understand how to control them. That's a part of what the anchors are all
about. All floaters must be anchored to a paragraph which appears on the
same page in the text flow. That's [one reason] why they can be hard to
control - as the text re-flows so goes the graphic.

Most of what you'll find here is PC-oriented, but the principles & concepts
are much the same. Have a gander when you have nothing "better" to do:

http://word.mvps.org/FAQs/DrawingGraphics.htm
(click Reload a few times as necessary if using Safari)

Regards |:>)
Bob Jones
[MVP] Office:Mac

 

[John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh]]

Hi John:

Yep: You've got it.

If you click a picture and an anchor appears, that's a sure sign that the
picture is "floating". If the picture is set to inline, the anchor won't
appear.

Cheers

Dear Daiya, John, & Bob

Very many thanks for clarifications.

I had misunderstood John's previous advice and was under the
impression that it made the caption anchored to the picture. (An icon
of an anchor appears at the bottom LH corner of the picture, but I've
no idea what it means.)

I was also under the impression that the caption automatically updated
its numbering if was moved.

Just so that I understand correctly this time, am I right in thinking
that the best plan is:

1. Change all my pictures to Inline and switch off AutoCaption.
2. Create para style Diagram, which is Centred and Keep with Next.
3. Copy picture into this para.
4. Create caption.

If move:

5. Select both picture and caption, and then move both together
6. Control-Click Caption Number and Select "Update Field"

Very many thanks

John

--

Please reply to the newsgroup to maintain the thread. Please do not email
me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <[email protected]>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Business Analyst, Consultant
Technical Writer.
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410