Commercial Printers, Publisher and Acrobat

[wfb]

I've seen a number of post helpfully pointing out that many commercial
printers don't play nicely with Publisher. Here in the antipodes hardly any
can deal with native Publisher files.

I've worked in the professional publishing business most of my life. In
recent years commercial printers have all moved over to using .pdf files --
at least in this part of the world. Surely this should mean that if you use
Publisher and Acrobat, there shouldn't be any problems. Or is that naive?

 

[Mike Koewler]

It's naive. It's like saying that most roofers have moved to using nail
guns, so if you buy a nail gun, you can put down a roof. Acrobat and pdf
are tools, nothing more. You have to use the correct settings -
according to what your printer instructs - for the file to output as you
expect. The number one rule regarding professional printing: Before you
do anything, contact your printer. Rule number two: see rule number one.

Mike

 

[Mike Koewler]

You are right, you can. You can also hammer a nail with a wrench. Now,
how the job will turn out, especially if you are trying to drive a four
penny nail into cedar wood in a tight corner, might be a different story.

Just my opinion, YMMV.

Mike

 

[°°°MS°Publisher°°°]

JoAnn I did not say you could not create a CMYK PDF with Publisher!!!

I would be careful using asbestos as you can get Mesothelioma if you do not
handle the product correctly.

--

 

[Mike Koewler]

You are splitting hairs, Jo Ann. Pub cannot create a CMYK pdf, no matter
how you shake the tree. Acrobat can take a RGB pdf file and turn it into
CMYK. As far as that goes, one can download QBOT's demo version, use
it (with whatever settings one needs) and create a CMYK file, then
remove the X's it puts on the page. The bottom line, though, it takes
another program (one that is not cheap) to make a CMYK file. Not that
that should bother someone making a living using Pub. It's a total
outlay of about $250, something that anyone should be able to amortize
over the course of six months or less in jobs.

Mike

"There is no issues using Publisher and PDF whatsoever. The only issue is
that the PDF file is still RGB. Now many printers have either Enfocus
Pitstop or 'Quite a Box of Tricks' to convert the PDF to CMYK. If the
printer does not have a suitable program to convert the PDF file from RGB to
CMYK, find a printer that does.
Publisher 2003 has CMYK built in, but not PDF conversion."

You did not say that but you did state that a .pdf file is still RGB. I
created a CMYK .pdf with Acrobat. At that time I only had Publisher 2002 and
the magazine publishing company did not (and probably still does not) accept
Publisher files but required CMYK.

And thank you for the warning about mesothelioma. That was actually quite
kind of you.

 

[Mike Koewler]

I know what you mean and you know what you mean, but just so other users do:

Publisher cannot output a CMYK pdf directly, but it can output a RGB
file as a pdf if one uses a pdf creation program, such as Acrobat or a
cheaper imitation. Using Acrobat, one can convert the RGB pdf into a
CMYK pdf, though one might argue about the various options available.

I'm not sure I can say I make my living creating CMYK pdf files, but it
is a very important part, just as doing the layout, selling the ads,
collecting money all are. But it's full time, to the tune of 60-75 hours
a week.

Mike

 

[°°°MS°Publisher°°°]

JoAnne how about you make a small PDF CMYK directly out of Publisher to
demonstrate how successful you are doing it.

--

 

[Ed Bennett]

After managing to set up OE-QuoteFix on his new PC, Ed reads a message

JoAnne how about you make a small PDF CMYK directly out of Publisher
to demonstrate how successful you are doing it.

How do you suggest she does that, seeing as Publisher does not have the
ability to export PDF?
Or do you mean post a PDF from Publisher 2002 in CMYK, where no program
other than Publisher and Acrobat has been used?

 

[°°°MS°Publisher°°°]

Ed take your two remaining grey cells back to the old age home and butt out
of intelligent discussion.

JoAnne is going to demonstrate making a CMYK PDF from Publisher 2003.

--

 

[Mike Koewler]

There's times when I could use an assistant, no doubt. Once a month, I
try to do a special issue that usually is about double the weekly size.
Alas, you would have to learn to use a different program, though!

Mike

 

[Ed Bennett]

After managing to set up OE-QuoteFix on his new PC, Ed reads a message

JoAnne is going to demonstrate making a CMYK PDF from Publisher 2003.

With or without using Acrobat?
And she was not claiming to do it in 2003, she was claiming to be able to do
it using Publisher 2002, with Acrobat.

 

[mact]

yes.

but you cannot make a composite color file from Publisher 2002 and earlier
that is CMYK...the resulting Postscript will be RGB, thus the PDF made from
it will be rgb

I've never tried to have Distiller convert color spaces--don't even know if
it can be done--but I'd not trust it.

the only reliable ways I've seen to get an rgb pdf to work properly is to
(a) let the rip handle the conversion (requires understanding how the rip
does such things and making the correct--not default--settings to accomplish
it--too many these days bought the gear but not the smarts to run it right)
or (b) convert it using an Acrobat plugin such as PitStop Pro or Quitre a
Box of Tricks.

 

[Ed Bennett]

After managing to set up OE-QuoteFix on his new PC, Ed reads a message

I've never tried to have Distiller convert color spaces--don't even
know if it can be done--but I'd not trust it.

That is exactly what JoAnn is trying to do, IIUC.

 

[Mike Koewler]

It's under the File/Print menu, Advanced Tab.

Mike

 

[°°°MS°Publisher°°°]

JoAnne are the voices talking to you again LOL

 

[°°°MS°Publisher°°°]

Ah ha, I C no 'e' - you are half baked.

Yeah, I also get those voices about eating chocolate, but I also get them
about eating cheese. I just *love* cheese - all types.

 

[cozzas]

I have been working on a newsletter project for several weeks. I used the color mixer to convert images to CMYK, changed Fireworks images to CMYK and dropped them back to Publisher 2000. I even used the Tools, Commercial Printing options to change to CMYK, printed to a pdf, ran the PitStop and after all this time, it still comes out as RGB. I even downloaded PagerMaker and used their Pub/Quark Converter. This required a lot of reformating time. I have just order Publisher 2003 and hope this version offers an easier way to convert Publisher files to CMYK.

After receiving my first proof from the printer, I am desparately trying to make editing changes that continue to output to RGB. It is very frustrating. Printers are suppose to print. Designers and illustrators should provide them the necessary files to get the output expected by their clients. Just my humble opinion.

jlawson

 

[Ed Bennett]

After managing to set up OE-QuoteFix on his new PC, Ed reads a message

I have been working on a newsletter project for several weeks. I
used the color mixer to convert images to CMYK, changed Fireworks
images to CMYK and dropped them back to Publisher 2000.

This will not work. There is no way you can get Composite CMYK output from
Publisher 2000 in one step, and in multiple steps, without expensive
software it is not reliable.

 

[Mike Koewler]

Ed,
Publisher 2000 in one step, and in multiple steps, without expensive
software it is not reliable.

I beg to differ. One can print to Acrobat, then use QBOT to convert to
CMYK. Acro is about $250 and QBOT $100, not cheap, not terribly
expensive as software goes. However, it is reliable, provided the right
profiles are selected.

Mike

 

[Ed Bennett]

After managing to set up OE-QuoteFix on his new PC, Ed reads a message

I beg to differ. One can print to Acrobat, then use QBOT to convert to
CMYK. Acro is about $250 and QBOT $100, not cheap, not terribly
expensive as software goes.

OK, maybe I meant "un-cheap" software.
Being a student, I have different ideas of "expensive".