Compressed TIF Files won't insert in Word 2000

[Mark]

I am running Windows 2000 and Office 2000 with all latest
Service Packs. We use Photoshop CS to scan images and
then save them as tif files. If I save the tifs with no
compression I am then able to insert them into MS Word
with no problem. However, if I save them with LZW
compression I am unable to insert them. I get a Convert
File dialog box and which ever format I chose I get an
error message "An error occurred while importing this
file - doc path". I can open the original compressed file
back in Photoshop and if I double-click in Windows it
opens fine in Imaging Preview. It doesn't matter if
Photoshop is installed on the pc - still the same
problem. I tried on a pc with Office 2003 and didn't have
the same problem - however I don't have enough licenses
for all the designers here so if anyone can solve this I
would be grateful.

 

[Jezebel]

Bear in mind that once the graphic is inserted into Word it gets converted
to Word's internal graphic format. So the choice of graphic file format is
largely irrelevant (not entirely -- it does affect the size of the Word
document); however in this case there is no benefit in using compressed TIF
rather than uncompressed -- Word still has to 'convert' the image anyway.

 

[Mark]

Thanks for this - but as you mention the size of the word
document is affected and that is the issue here. So I
suppose I really need to know if it is possible to insert
the compressed files and if not what difference will it
make with regard to file sizes - it is hard to tell when I
can insert the uncompressed file but not the compressed
one. For example, working with an original uncompressed
tif file that is 3.2MB in size - when it is inserted into
word and the doc file then saved the new word file is
1.7MB is size! What would happen if I could (is it
possible?) get the compressed one to insert - or does it
not matter?
Thanks again.

 

[Mark]

Further - in terms of storage of images, compressed files
take up much less space on both pc's and servers. I work
for a gov org and therefore there are certain archiving
requirements so file size is definitely an issue.

 

[Jezebel]

I understand the intention of compressed files -- it's just that it won't
necessarily make any difference to the size of the Word document you end up
with. The graphic, at the Word end, is converted to WMF format. The size of
that depends to some extent on the original format (eg GIF vs TIF), but a
compressed TIF is still a TIF and represents exactly the same amount of
information once converted to WMF.

As an experiment, try this: in the graphic program, set the image to the
size and resolution you want to end up with in Word. Now save the image in
the various formats available (GIF, TIF, JPG, etc). Now make copies of your
document, inserting one of those file formats in each case: compare the
resulting Word file sizes. The results are often unexpected.

Above all, make sure you do nothing to the graphic once you get it into
Word -- any resizing or graphic manipulation blows out the Word file size.

 

[Mark]

You're correct with regard to file sizes in word. As an
experiment I created two tif files - one uncompressed
(3.2MB) and one compressed (1.8MB). I then created 2 word
docs in Office 2003 (as opposed to 2000) and inserted the
compressed tif in one and uncompressed in the other - both
word docs end up being the same size, 1.7MB!
So with regard to just Word, uncompressed as opposed to
compressed doesn't seem to matter. However, I still have
the problem with storage and the file size of the original
images. If I don't compress them I will fill up storage
at approx 45% faster rate than with uncompressed...so, do
you know if it is possible to insert compressed tif files
(created in Photoshop CS)into Word 2000.

 

[Bob Buckland ?:-\)]

Hi Mark,

Are these fax/greyscale/color TIF files?
Are these multipage TIFFs?

Word 2000's filter supports LZW compression but not
24 bit color JPEG compression.

Are you setting a specific Color Model choice
in Photoshop? Not all are supported in Office.

I created several sample files using

Irfanview
Photodraw 2000
MS Office 2000 Photo Editor
MS Windows/Kodak Imaging

all using LZW Compression and had no problems with
Insert=>Picture=>From File with view there set to 'Preview'
(other than very slow conversion on the Kodak Imaging ones).


=========
You're correct with regard to file sizes in word. As an
experiment I created two tif files - one uncompressed
(3.2MB) and one compressed (1.8MB). I then created 2 word
docs in Office 2003 (as opposed to 2000) and inserted the
compressed tif in one and uncompressed in the other - both
word docs end up being the same size, 1.7MB!
So with regard to just Word, uncompressed as opposed to
compressed doesn't seem to matter. However, I still have
the problem with storage and the file size of the original
images. If I don't compress them I will fill up storage
at approx 45% faster rate than with uncompressed...so, do
you know if it is possible to insert compressed tif files
(created in Photoshop CS)into Word 2000. >>

 

[Mark]

Hi Bob

The TIF files are greyscale, one page. Speaking to the designers here when
they create the tifs - if it is just type on a page then B and W, if any
grey then greyscale etc

I have a couple of files - one compressed, one uncompressed if that is any
use. They are both approx 1/2Mb though.

Also has this site changed since last week - had to use hotmail address to
login into it?

Thanks
Mark

 

[Bob Buckland ?:-\)]

Hi Mark,


If you're using some access points in the web interface to
the MS peer newsgroups/communities then you may need to
login with passport. If you use an NNTP newsreader,
such as Outlook Express there isn't a login through
news://msnews.microsoft.com as the server.

Did you try creating or resaving the same TIF file from
within MS Office PhotoEditor?

Please email me a zip file of some of your sample TIF files
if possible to 75214.226 [at] csi.com
and I'll have a look.

======
Hi Bob

The TIF files are greyscale, one page. Speaking to the designers here when
they create the tifs - if it is just type on a page then B and W, if any
grey then greyscale etc

I have a couple of files - one compressed, one uncompressed if that is any
use. They are both approx 1/2Mb though.

Also has this site changed since last week - had to use hotmail address to
login into it?

Thanks
Mark >>

 

[Bob Buckland ?:-\)]

Hi Mark,

Okay. I looked at the TIF sample files you sent me.
Both worked in Word 2002 and 2003, but in 2000 both
Word and MS Office Photo editor choked on the one that
has Adobe's implementation of LZW compression.

However, if I opened the compressed file in Irfanview
(http://www.irfanview.com ) and then saved it without
modification (replacing the original file of the same name
and used LZW compression there, it worked fine in Word 2000.

It appears that there's some setting (grey scale pallette
save, or) that's not obvious but isn't working with
Office 2000 (possibly something stored in the file header).
The only immediately visible property
difference was that your compressed TIF has 231 colors,
while both the uncompressed TIF and the Irfanview saved
one has 230.

Are there any optional adjustments for the TIF settings
when you save from Adobe Photoshop?

=========
Hi Bob

The TIF files are greyscale, one page. Speaking to the designers here when
they create the tifs - if it is just type on a page then B and W, if any
grey then greyscale etc

I have a couple of files - one compressed, one uncompressed if that is any
use. They are both approx 1/2Mb though.

Also has this site changed since last week - had to use hotmail address to
login into it?

Thanks
Mark>>
--
Let us know if this helped you,

Bob Buckland ?
MS Office System Products MVP

*Courtesy is not expensive and can pay big dividends*

Office 2003 Editions explained
http://www.microsoft.com/uk/office/editions.mspx

 

[Mark]

Hi Bob

Thanks for the time spent on this. I will pass on the info to our designers
and see if there is anything they can find in the app.

Mark

 

[Mark]

Hi Bob

We can't find anything here in Photoshop CS within the Save options - it
basically just saves it with LZW compression and that's it - nothing in there
to configure.

So in light of any other information we may have to chalk this one up to
experience and maybe even go back to Photoshop 7 with which there were no
problems with LZW compression.

Thanks again
Mark

 

[Bob Buckland ?:-\)]

Hi Mark,

You may want to try dropping by the Adobe Photoshop forums/newsgroups
( http://studio.adobe.com )
on this one as well as here.

You also may want to have your folks
experiment with using 24 bit PNG as a format (a native format for Office)
to see if that would give satisfactory results.

=======
Hi Bob

We can't find anything here in Photoshop CS within the Save options - it
basically just saves it with LZW compression and that's it - nothing in there
to configure.

So in light of any other information we may have to chalk this one up to
experience and maybe even go back to Photoshop 7 with which there were no
problems with LZW compression.

Thanks again
Mark>>
--
Let us know if this helped you,

Bob Buckland ?
MS Office System Products MVP

*Courtesy is not expensive and can pay big dividends*

Office 2003 Editions explained
http://www.microsoft.com/uk/office/editions.mspx