What do we buy for Access 2003 Run-Time?

[Ron Ehrlich]

We own one copy of full MS Office Access 2003. We want to place an already
developed Access 2003 application on other computers that do not have Access
2003 installed, and we are not sure what to buy or where to buy it. Do we
buy "Microsoft Access 2003 Developer Extensions" or do we buy "Visual Studio
Tools for Office" or something else? Will it really cost us $799? What is
the smartest thing to do here? Where do we buy what we need? Please
explain. Thanks in advance.

 

[Douglas J. Steele]

You need the Microsoft Access 2003 Developer Extensions, but the only way to
get that legally is by buying Visual Studio Tools for Office. Yes, it really
costs that much, but it lets you distribute as many copies of the runtime as
you like. If you're talking about distributing to, say, 5 or even 10 clients
that don't have Access, it's probably not worthwhile. If you're talking
about 20 or more, then obviously it's cheaper than purchasing that many
copies of Access.

 

[Ron Ehrlich]

Doug, Thx for the reply. This situation is similar to going to a car dealer
to buy one simple accessory for your car, and findout out that you are forced
to but nine other features that are of no use to you. All we want is to copy
the MDE file one our development computer to 3 other PC's. We don't want the
Package Wizard, the Property Scanner Add-In, the Custom Setup Wizard, nor are
we interested in the complete source code for the tools included in the
product. If MS wants to encourage the public to honor license agreements,
this is definitely not the way to go. It seems ridiculous to pay eight
hundred bucks, just to be able to open an MDE file on 3 other computers. A
better philosophy would be to break up the run-time into levels, as some
other sellers do: e.g., 1-10 licenses at say $99 per computer, and $799 for
more than 10, or sumfin like dat. I hope someone at MS sees this post, sigh.

 

[Douglas J. Steele]

For 3 PCs,. you're far better off buying 3 copies of Access.

Even if the cost of ADE was reduced for your situation, the headaches of
deploying runtime applications wouldn't make it worthwhile.

That's just my 2 cents, though.

If you feel strongly enough about it, you might consider contacting
Microsoft and making your view known. Check
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?pr=cntactms for contact
information.

 

[Ron Ehrlich]

Not sure what you mean by "headaches of deployment". To deploy, we would
simply copy a single .MDE file from one system to the other.

 

[William Hindman]

....I'm sorry but that got a serious belly laugh out of me ...an mde is not
an executable file ...it contains only the compiled application code and
objects ...it requires the entire Access runtime plus license, references,
dlls, ocx's, etc in order to run ...that's what the packaging wizards are
for, poor as they may be.

....all of that exists in a full Access install ...and almost none of it
exists on a system without it ...so in order to deploy an mde you must first
package it with the access runtime and all of its tertiary objects ...and
then do an install on the client system of the entire package.

....if you want an executable then you must move up the food chain to VB.Net
or C#.

William Hindman

 

[Douglas J. Steele]

No, you wouldn't "simply copy a single .MDE file from one system to the
other".

You have to package the runtime together with the MDE. An MDE file isn't
self-contained: it requires that msaccess.exe exist on the client machine in
order to use it. That's why you need the runtime: to install msaccess.exe on
each desktop that doesn't already have Access installed.

 

[Rick Brandt]

Not sure what you mean by "headaches of deployment". To deploy, we
would simply copy a single .MDE file from one system to the other.

In addition to what others have clarified about needing to install the runtime
you also have to consider that a simple app that can be used in the retail
Access environment is not necessarily an app that can successfully be run with
the runtime.

A runtime app has to be much more fully developed. None of the built in GUI or
error handling is available in the runtime. The runtime interface consists
entirely of the forms, reports, menus, and toolbars that you develop for it.
Unhandled errors will unceremoniously toss the user out of the app and you have
to provide all of your own menus and toolbars ( no db window access).

For someone who already builds very complete and "polished" apps deploying them
with the runtime would only involve a few extra hours to create the install
package. For a simple app that depends heavily on the built in GUI you would
need to spend many more man-hours on it before it would be suitable for the
runtime environment.

 

[Ron Ehrlich]

Belly laugh you may. But, actually, in Access 2000 on a different project,
all I did was copy the mde file (duhh, I know that's not an executable) and
the Access 2000 run time module was all we needed to have on the non-Access
machines. This was the way we operated for over 4 years. No packaging, no
wizards, no magic.
I know you mean well, sorry for the sarcasm.
--
Ron Ehrlich

....I'm sorry but that got a serious belly laugh out of me ...an mde is not
an executable file ...it contains only the compiled application code and
objects ...it requires the entire Access runtime plus license, references,
dlls, ocx's, etc in order to run ...that's what the packaging wizards are
for, poor as they may be.

....all of that exists in a full Access install ...and almost none of it
exists on a system without it ...so in order to deploy an mde you must first
package it with the access runtime and all of its tertiary objects ...and
then do an install on the client system of the entire package.

....if you want an executable then you must move up the food chain to VB.Net
or C#.

William Hindman

 

[Ron Ehrlich]

Doug,
I understand that each target machine needs the msaccess.exe module and then
the mde file. But thats all I want to buy, just the msaccess.exe for Access
2003 and the legal license to install msaccess.exe on three machines. Since
I am doing this for a volunteer group who can hardly afford the $800, it
seems a high cost.

 

[Ron Ehrlich]

Thanks for your reply Rick. I have been developing and deploying successful
Access apps in the run-time environment for over 5 years using Access 2000.
The client had already installed the Access run-time software for apps other
than mine. All I ever did was to email the client a single mde file and
things worked smoothly. It seems from these posts that Access 2003 run-time
situations require a bunch of complexities that were not previously involved.
Not to mention the $800.

 

[Tony Toews]

Thanks for your reply Rick. I have been developing and deploying successful
Access apps in the run-time environment for over 5 years using Access 2000.
The client had already installed the Access run-time software for apps other
than mine. All I ever did was to email the client a single mde file and
things worked smoothly. It seems from these posts that Access 2003 run-time
situations require a bunch of complexities that were not previously involved.
Not to mention the $800.

It's more along the lines of for many situations the runtime will work
well. Especially in a corporate or other environment where you can
control the other software installed.

However if you the developer want to ensure that folks out there, in
the wild blue yonder, can install and run our apps without having any
problems or causing any problems no matter what is already installed
there then you need to spend more time and possibly money.

Microsoft Access (Office) Developer Edition FAQ
http://www.granite.ab.ca/access/developereditionfaq.htm

Tony
--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Please respond only in the newsgroups so that others can
read the entire thread of messages.
Microsoft Access Links, Hints, Tips & Accounting Systems at
http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm

 

[aaron.kempf]

you don't need to buy a goddamn thing.

the Access runtime is available on the Office 2003 Professional Disk.

MS is too fucking stupid to make this a viable option otherwise; so
just blatantly break their licensing restrictions.

 

[Brendan Reynolds]

The other complexities were always previously involved, Ron. it's just that,
because your client had previously installed the run-time, you never had to
deal with them before. I can tell you from painful personal experience that
building and installing Access 2000 runtimes was not a lot of fun. As far as
I can tell, the process has not become significantly more or less complex in
Access 2003.

For small numbers of users at a single client site, check out the various
licensing options available. You can get significant discounts when you buy
as few as five licenses.

 

[William Hindman]

Ron

A2K3 runtimes are no more complicated than previous versions ...you need the
VSTO in order to license your distribution to systems without Access
installed ...the VSTO also includes tools to make the deployment much more
likely to succeed in a wide variety of user environments.

It appears that the price tag of $750 is the hang-up ...if so, I suggest you
take a look at the MS Partner Empower Program ...you would seem to easily
qualify for it (imnsho) and at only $375 a year it gives you virtually every
tool MS has including VSTO ...that's 50% of the retail VSTO price alone plus
you get everything else.

hth

William Hindman

 

[William Hindman]

....sigh ...read the Eula ...the Office Pro disk also contains a full install
of Access ...do you think that licenses you to install it on other systems?
....you need the VSTO in order to install licensed copies of the runtime on
systems without an Access 2K3 install ...else you might as well distribute a
pirated copy and wait for MS to lock your clients out.

William Hindman

 

[manningfan]

www.torrentspy.com

I got the full version for free. Why pay for buggy programs?

 

[Craig Alexander Morrison]

Be careful, the VSTO without the ADE (Access Developer Extensions) is not
much use, does the MSPE Program include the ADE?


--
Slainte

Craig Alexander Morrison
Crawbridge Data (Scotland) Limited

Small Business Solutions Provider

 

[aaron.kempf]

it just makes no sense; if you have 2 different ART programs-- to have
2 different copies of the ART.

I urge you to just install the AccessRT.msi from the Office 2003
professional disk.

Microsoft has made it impossible to use otherwise.

-Aaron

 

[William Hindman]

....I see ...you pirated the program ...so when you go to update it and MS
asks to inventory your and/or your client's software, where will you find
new clients? ...in jail?

....it always amazes me when supposedly intelligent people post to an MS
operated newsgroup that they pirated MS software ...no skin off my nose of
course, I enjoy watching stupid pet tricks as well.

William Hindman