work time vs. calendar time

[AndrewE]

I'm using Project to manage several contracts I have - I have prepared Gantt
charts for each.

I want the bars in my Gantt charts to represent the general span of days I
have to do a task, so I enter start date and end date accordingly. For
example, I may have a task called "Research Speakers" that I have two weeks
to undertake, starting June 1 through to June 14. This, of course, generates
a Duration for this task of 14 days

However, I've really only got a budget of 12 hours for this work, and
somehow I'd like this displayed on the chart, to remind myself to not go over
budget. I dont' know exactly when in the 2 weeks that I'll expend the 12
hours, and frankly don't need this displayed. I do the work on the task when
I can, based on committments to other projects. I have learned how to
combine projects using the Window / New View option. Very handy.

Suggestions on how to deal with these "budgeted hours"?

 

[Steve House]

You're trying to redefine duration into something that it is not. The
duration of a task is not the window of time in which you have to complete
it. Rather, a task is a physical activity and its duration is the amount of
working time units between the instant observable work is first performed on
it until the instant the work on it has actually been completed. In the
example you presented, if your task could begin on 01 June and will require
12 hours of work (and assuming whenever you do begin work on it you plan to
go at it full-time until it is done) and needs to be done no later than 14
June, it is NOT a 2-week duration task but instead it is a 12-hour duration
task with an Early Start of 01 June and a deadline of 14 June. Now it's
certainly possible to kludge it together so that you show the task as having
a 2-week duration (and by the way, that duration would be 10 days, not 14,
because non-working time such as weekends doesn't count in the duration
numbers) and you're working on it at a level of 15% so as to do 12 hours of
work in total but that's anathema to the whole process of planning a project
to complete in the shortest possible time. If you can start 01 June and
need to work on it for 12 hours to complete the required deliverable, why
not just "git 'er done" ASAP and plan to complete it by noon on the 2nd so
you can move on to something else? Why plan on wasting time dilly-dally'ing
around until the 14th, and delaying the schedules for the subsequent work in
the process? Work on Lombardi time -- "If you're not 15 minutes (or in this
case, 12 days) early, you're late!" <grin>

 

[AndrewE]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for that very interesting answer! It has, and will, give me lots to
think about with respect to productivity and how MS Project can facilitate it.

Of interest to you, and a contrarian viewpoint, might be some of the
writings of David Allen, particularly his book "Getting Things Done". I have
found it to be most helpful in my very diverse consulting life, where I can
be juggling 7 paying clients at once, plus emails, plus prospects, plus
personal commitments etc..

Allen argues that lives are now too complex, and a human's hourly capacity
for productivity in the different types of work we need to undertake so
varied, that linear "to do lists" and "timelines" don't work. Rather, we
must manage productivity by ensuring that somewhere we have a system that
tracks all the projects we have, easily allowing us to see the immanent
priorities, etc. This gives the subconscious permission to calm down and
quite worrying that something is being forgotten. It also then lets the
conscious make clear choices about the best thing to do, right now, give the
time we have, our mood, etc.

I'm using project with this theory in mind. So my desire to note budgeted
time for a task is more of an "accounting" feature - I'd just like to be
reminded when I go to work on something roughly how long I should give it.

Perhaps there is a number field, or a different type of Duration field, that
I could insert beside each task, or after start and end dates, that would
work best for me? Ideally, project would sum all the sub-task "times" I'm
entering into the task heading for the level above, so I end up with total
project time budgets.

Anyway - let me know if you have more thoughts on any of this.

Andrew

You're trying to redefine duration into something that it is not. The
duration of a task is not the window of time in which you have to complete
it. Rather, a task is a physical activity and its duration is the amount of
working time units between the instant observable work is first performed on
it until the instant the work on it has actually been completed. In the
example you presented, if your task could begin on 01 June and will require
12 hours of work (and assuming whenever you do begin work on it you plan to
go at it full-time until it is done) and needs to be done no later than 14
June, it is NOT a 2-week duration task but instead it is a 12-hour duration
task with an Early Start of 01 June and a deadline of 14 June. Now it's
certainly possible to kludge it together so that you show the task as having
a 2-week duration (and by the way, that duration would be 10 days, not 14,
because non-working time such as weekends doesn't count in the duration
numbers) and you're working on it at a level of 15% so as to do 12 hours of
work in total but that's anathema to the whole process of planning a project
to complete in the shortest possible time. If you can start 01 June and
need to work on it for 12 hours to complete the required deliverable, why
not just "git 'er done" ASAP and plan to complete it by noon on the 2nd so
you can move on to something else? Why plan on wasting time dilly-dally'ing
around until the 14th, and delaying the schedules for the subsequent work in
the process? Work on Lombardi time -- "If you're not 15 minutes (or in this
case, 12 days) early, you're late!" <grin>
--
Steve House [Project MVP]
MS Project Trainer & Consultant
Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs

I'm using Project to manage several contracts I have - I have prepared
Gantt
charts for each.

I want the bars in my Gantt charts to represent the general span of days I
have to do a task, so I enter start date and end date accordingly. For
example, I may have a task called "Research Speakers" that I have two
weeks
to undertake, starting June 1 through to June 14. This, of course,
generates
a Duration for this task of 14 days

However, I've really only got a budget of 12 hours for this work, and
somehow I'd like this displayed on the chart, to remind myself to not go
over
budget. I dont' know exactly when in the 2 weeks that I'll expend the 12
hours, and frankly don't need this displayed. I do the work on the task
when
I can, based on committments to other projects. I have learned how to
combine projects using the Window / New View option. Very handy.

Suggestions on how to deal with these "budgeted hours"?

 

[Steve House]

To a certain extent it seems your trying to use Project in a role for which
it is not designed. It is NOT a calendaring program nor a to-do list nor a
time management program nor an accounting program. It is expressly designed
to create calculate work schedules for a set of inter-related tasks leading
to the creation of a clearly defined deliverable in the shortest possible
time. You tell it what tasks need to be done, what assets you have at your
disposal to do them, and an estimate of how long or how much work each
activity requires and it tells you when you should be scheduling everything
so that it all comes together on-time and within-budget.

We are in the same boat, you and I, as far as scheduling our own personal
work lives and frankly, MS Project is the last thing I'd think of to use to
try to manage it. Now if I have to plan a courseware development project,
or if my plans to redirect my professional activities come to fruition and I
need to pull together all the details involved in a video production
project, MS Project is just the tool to use. But those are plans for
projects, not my workday.
--
Steve House [Project MVP]
MS Project Trainer & Consultant
Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs

Hi Steve,

Thanks for that very interesting answer! It has, and will, give me lots
to
think about with respect to productivity and how MS Project can facilitate
it.

Of interest to you, and a contrarian viewpoint, might be some of the
writings of David Allen, particularly his book "Getting Things Done". I
have
found it to be most helpful in my very diverse consulting life, where I
can
be juggling 7 paying clients at once, plus emails, plus prospects, plus
personal commitments etc..

Allen argues that lives are now too complex, and a human's hourly capacity
for productivity in the different types of work we need to undertake so
varied, that linear "to do lists" and "timelines" don't work. Rather, we
must manage productivity by ensuring that somewhere we have a system that
tracks all the projects we have, easily allowing us to see the immanent
priorities, etc. This gives the subconscious permission to calm down and
quite worrying that something is being forgotten. It also then lets the
conscious make clear choices about the best thing to do, right now, give
the
time we have, our mood, etc.

I'm using project with this theory in mind. So my desire to note budgeted
time for a task is more of an "accounting" feature - I'd just like to be
reminded when I go to work on something roughly how long I should give it.

Perhaps there is a number field, or a different type of Duration field,
that
I could insert beside each task, or after start and end dates, that would
work best for me? Ideally, project would sum all the sub-task "times" I'm
entering into the task heading for the level above, so I end up with total
project time budgets.

Anyway - let me know if you have more thoughts on any of this.

Andrew

You're trying to redefine duration into something that it is not. The
duration of a task is not the window of time in which you have to
complete
it. Rather, a task is a physical activity and its duration is the amount
of
working time units between the instant observable work is first performed
on
it until the instant the work on it has actually been completed. In the
example you presented, if your task could begin on 01 June and will
require
12 hours of work (and assuming whenever you do begin work on it you plan
to
go at it full-time until it is done) and needs to be done no later than
14
June, it is NOT a 2-week duration task but instead it is a 12-hour
duration
task with an Early Start of 01 June and a deadline of 14 June. Now it's
certainly possible to kludge it together so that you show the task as
having
a 2-week duration (and by the way, that duration would be 10 days, not
14,
because non-working time such as weekends doesn't count in the duration
numbers) and you're working on it at a level of 15% so as to do 12 hours
of
work in total but that's anathema to the whole process of planning a
project
to complete in the shortest possible time. If you can start 01 June and
need to work on it for 12 hours to complete the required deliverable, why
not just "git 'er done" ASAP and plan to complete it by noon on the 2nd
so
you can move on to something else? Why plan on wasting time
dilly-dally'ing
around until the 14th, and delaying the schedules for the subsequent work
in
the process? Work on Lombardi time -- "If you're not 15 minutes (or in
this
case, 12 days) early, you're late!" <grin>
--
Steve House [Project MVP]
MS Project Trainer & Consultant
Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs

I'm using Project to manage several contracts I have - I have prepared
Gantt
charts for each.

I want the bars in my Gantt charts to represent the general span of
days I
have to do a task, so I enter start date and end date accordingly. For
example, I may have a task called "Research Speakers" that I have two
weeks
to undertake, starting June 1 through to June 14. This, of course,
generates
a Duration for this task of 14 days

However, I've really only got a budget of 12 hours for this work, and
somehow I'd like this displayed on the chart, to remind myself to not
go
over
budget. I dont' know exactly when in the 2 weeks that I'll expend the
12
hours, and frankly don't need this displayed. I do the work on the
task
when
I can, based on committments to other projects. I have learned how to
combine projects using the Window / New View option. Very handy.

Suggestions on how to deal with these "budgeted hours"?

 

[AndrewE]

good insights - thanks Steve

do check out the David Allen website, and pick up his book - good stuff

Andrew

To a certain extent it seems your trying to use Project in a role for which
it is not designed. It is NOT a calendaring program nor a to-do list nor a
time management program nor an accounting program. It is expressly designed
to create calculate work schedules for a set of inter-related tasks leading
to the creation of a clearly defined deliverable in the shortest possible
time. You tell it what tasks need to be done, what assets you have at your
disposal to do them, and an estimate of how long or how much work each
activity requires and it tells you when you should be scheduling everything
so that it all comes together on-time and within-budget.

We are in the same boat, you and I, as far as scheduling our own personal
work lives and frankly, MS Project is the last thing I'd think of to use to
try to manage it. Now if I have to plan a courseware development project,
or if my plans to redirect my professional activities come to fruition and I
need to pull together all the details involved in a video production
project, MS Project is just the tool to use. But those are plans for
projects, not my workday.
--
Steve House [Project MVP]
MS Project Trainer & Consultant
Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs

Hi Steve,

Thanks for that very interesting answer! It has, and will, give me lots
to
think about with respect to productivity and how MS Project can facilitate
it.

Of interest to you, and a contrarian viewpoint, might be some of the
writings of David Allen, particularly his book "Getting Things Done". I
have
found it to be most helpful in my very diverse consulting life, where I
can
be juggling 7 paying clients at once, plus emails, plus prospects, plus
personal commitments etc..

Allen argues that lives are now too complex, and a human's hourly capacity
for productivity in the different types of work we need to undertake so
varied, that linear "to do lists" and "timelines" don't work. Rather, we
must manage productivity by ensuring that somewhere we have a system that
tracks all the projects we have, easily allowing us to see the immanent
priorities, etc. This gives the subconscious permission to calm down and
quite worrying that something is being forgotten. It also then lets the
conscious make clear choices about the best thing to do, right now, give
the
time we have, our mood, etc.

I'm using project with this theory in mind. So my desire to note budgeted
time for a task is more of an "accounting" feature - I'd just like to be
reminded when I go to work on something roughly how long I should give it.

Perhaps there is a number field, or a different type of Duration field,
that
I could insert beside each task, or after start and end dates, that would
work best for me? Ideally, project would sum all the sub-task "times" I'm
entering into the task heading for the level above, so I end up with total
project time budgets.

Anyway - let me know if you have more thoughts on any of this.

Andrew

You're trying to redefine duration into something that it is not. The
duration of a task is not the window of time in which you have to
complete
it. Rather, a task is a physical activity and its duration is the amount
of
working time units between the instant observable work is first performed
on
it until the instant the work on it has actually been completed. In the
example you presented, if your task could begin on 01 June and will
require
12 hours of work (and assuming whenever you do begin work on it you plan
to
go at it full-time until it is done) and needs to be done no later than
14
June, it is NOT a 2-week duration task but instead it is a 12-hour
duration
task with an Early Start of 01 June and a deadline of 14 June. Now it's
certainly possible to kludge it together so that you show the task as
having
a 2-week duration (and by the way, that duration would be 10 days, not
14,
because non-working time such as weekends doesn't count in the duration
numbers) and you're working on it at a level of 15% so as to do 12 hours
of
work in total but that's anathema to the whole process of planning a
project
to complete in the shortest possible time. If you can start 01 June and
need to work on it for 12 hours to complete the required deliverable, why
not just "git 'er done" ASAP and plan to complete it by noon on the 2nd
so
you can move on to something else? Why plan on wasting time
dilly-dally'ing
around until the 14th, and delaying the schedules for the subsequent work
in
the process? Work on Lombardi time -- "If you're not 15 minutes (or in
this
case, 12 days) early, you're late!" <grin>
--
Steve House [Project MVP]
MS Project Trainer & Consultant
Visit http://www.mvps.org/project/faqs.htm for the FAQs



I'm using Project to manage several contracts I have - I have prepared
Gantt
charts for each.

I want the bars in my Gantt charts to represent the general span of
days I
have to do a task, so I enter start date and end date accordingly. For
example, I may have a task called "Research Speakers" that I have two
weeks
to undertake, starting June 1 through to June 14. This, of course,
generates
a Duration for this task of 14 days

However, I've really only got a budget of 12 hours for this work, and
somehow I'd like this displayed on the chart, to remind myself to not
go
over
budget. I dont' know exactly when in the 2 weeks that I'll expend the
12
hours, and frankly don't need this displayed. I do the work on the
task
when
I can, based on committments to other projects. I have learned how to
combine projects using the Window / New View option. Very handy.

Suggestions on how to deal with these "budgeted hours"?