Non-standard Page numbering and Indexing question

[Ray Cox]

Because of unique needs of my document (230 pages) I am using a manual page
numbering scheme instead of using any of the automated page numbering
features in Word 2003. My problem comes when I need to create an index.

The numbering in the document is offset from the actual Word page number,
i.e. I need for numbering for indexing purposes to start page 1 at actual
page 3 of the Word document.

I can use the Word techniques for altering the numbering (start over with
page 1 at page 3, etc.) but then I have to use the Word auto page numbering
feature, which will print a page number in addition to my own manually
entered page number.

How can I offset the MS page number for indexing purposes without having an
auto-generated page number print on each page?

R Cox

 

[Daiya Mitchell]

Manually entering page numbers sounds like a bad idea and is going to be
very difficult to maintain. I'd be interested in hear the rationale
there--it's likely there's a way to make Word fulfill those needs.
Particularly since it sounds like the index is going to be wrong, as of
course it's going to refer people to the Word-generated page number, not
what you have as a page number. So how will they find the right page, since
that number won't be printed on it?

However, some possibilities for what you say you want to do:

Try this: *don't* enter a page number. View | Header/Footer and click on
the Format Page Number icon on the H/F toolbar (# with a hand). I'm not sure
Word will let you format a page number when you haven't used one, but give
it a try. This might be really tricky to maintain, as you won't know if it
worked, cause you won't be able to see the number.

Alternatively, View | Header/Footer, enter the Word page number into the
footer, then select the page number, and use Format | Font to format it as
hidden text so that it should not print. You can toggle viewing hidden text
with ¶ on the standard toolbar, and in Tools | Options | Print, make sure
hidden text is not set to print. This is probably the best option. If you
already have a lot of section breaks, and you have unlinked the headers from
each other, you may need to repeat this in each section.

Alternatively, when you use Insert | Page Number, the page number is put in
the header in a frame. You could possibly drag that frame to a non-printing
area of the page, say right above the bottom edge where most printers won't
print text. But frames occasionally wander--I'd say that is the worst
option.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Like Daiya, I think manually numbering pages is doomed to failure, and I
suspect it's possible to achieve what you want in a different way. It is
perfectly possible to get Word to start numbering pages at 1 on page 3
(omitting numbers on the first two pages) and many other much more complex
schemes. I suspect that you've only looked at the Insert | Page Numbers
dialog and concluded that it didn't meet your needs. We actually don't
advise using page numbers inserted that way anyway. It's much better to
insert them directly in the header/footer.

I suggest you read the following articles and post back if you find you
still need to number your pages manually:

How to control the page numbering in a Word document
http://word.mvps.org/FAQs/Numbering/PageNumbering.htm

How to set up a document with front matter numbered separately
http://word.mvps.org/FAQs/Formatting/NumberingFrontMatter.htm

Making the most of headers and footers
http://sbarnhill.mvps.org/WordFAQs/HeaderFooter.htm

 

[Ray Cox]

Manually entering page numbers sounds like a bad idea and is going to be

very difficult to maintain. I'd be interested in hear the rationale
there--it's likely there's a way to make Word fulfill those needs.

An organization I belong to is going to reprint a book that they originally
published in 1980. We also wanted to make corrections as needed and to make
a text-searchable and indexed CD version of the book. The original book was
obviously not created electronically (no electronic file existed), so we
recreated the book for our 2nd edition by scanning, OCRing, and recreating
each page in electronic format. The book is a formatting nightmare, with
the format changing with almost every page (lots of historical documents,
articles written by different people, pictures (from 1 to 4) printed in
different areas of each page, etc...there are 68 sections within the first
80 pages). We also wanted to keep the original "look and feel" of the
original book, and that is the bottom line as far as the decision to
manually do page numbers is concerned. The various Word page options just
can't exactly duplicate the page number location in the original book.
Since we will be creating each page to contain exactly the same text and
format as the original page, we don't have to deal with the problem of
flowing text constantly changing it's location with respect to page number,
so the manual page number entry doesn't end up causing a problem. I use a
separate text box set to float above all other text, so it is anchored and
stays in the same place regardless of what happens during editing of that
page.

I tried all of your suggestions (and thanks for taking the time to present
them) but none of them ended up hiding an auto-generated page number so that
it didn't print.

After some experimenting, however, I did find out how to do what I needed.

1. Entered a continuous section break on the page prior to where I wanted
numbering to restart to correspond with the printed document page numbers.

2. Use the Insert | Page Numbers | Format feature to designate what number
to start "my" page 1 at.

3. Remove the Page Number from the Header/Footer as follows: Select View |
Header and Footer; switch to footer; select the frame around the page number
showing in the footer; press Delete.

This deletes the page numbers from ALL footers, but somehow leaves the
document renumbering done in step 1 in place. I can select any page, and
the page number shown at the far left of the status bar will agree with the
page number (for printing) entered in my document. Hopefully (I haven't
done the final step of indexing yet) the numbers generated by the index
feature will correspond with the renumbered pages.

Hope this might help someone else with this sticky of a problem that MS
didn't really think of a direct way of doing.

Ray

 

[Daiya Mitchell]

Interesting.....thanks for the explanation....

The hidden text trick did work fine here, but just in a simple test
document.

An organization I belong to is going to reprint a book that they originally
published in 1980. We also wanted to make corrections as needed and to make
a text-searchable and indexed CD version of the book. The original book was
obviously not created electronically (no electronic file existed), so we
recreated the book for our 2nd edition by scanning, OCRing, and recreating
each page in electronic format. The book is a formatting nightmare, with
the format changing with almost every page (lots of historical documents,
articles written by different people, pictures (from 1 to 4) printed in
different areas of each page, etc...there are 68 sections within the first
80 pages). We also wanted to keep the original "look and feel" of the
original book, and that is the bottom line as far as the decision to
manually do page numbers is concerned. The various Word page options just
can't exactly duplicate the page number location in the original book.
Since we will be creating each page to contain exactly the same text and
format as the original page, we don't have to deal with the problem of
flowing text constantly changing it's location with respect to page number,
so the manual page number entry doesn't end up causing a problem. I use a
separate text box set to float above all other text, so it is anchored and
stays in the same place regardless of what happens during editing of that
page.

I tried all of your suggestions (and thanks for taking the time to present
them) but none of them ended up hiding an auto-generated page number so that
it didn't print.

After some experimenting, however, I did find out how to do what I needed.

<snip>

 

[Ray Cox]

If you read my problem closely, you will see that I needed to renumber the
pages so that indexing would work correctly, but I didn't want Word to print
the page numbers for me, as Word could not match the page number scheme used
in edition 1 of a book that we are duplicating.

As I have already numbered the 230 pages manually and it is working
perfectly for my purposes (the failure I am doomed to has not occurred), I
see no reason to spend more time experimenting with Word to try and
duplicate what I have done manually, then to have to return and remove 230
separate text boxes. Yes, it was labor intensive, but we have duplicated
the original where MSWord could not, so we have achieved our goal.

I am familiar with headers/footers and their implementation. I read all of
the articles you quoted and many more for about 2 hours in trying to find a
solution to my situation before I posted my question to the newsgroup.

There are actually times when MS just doesn't have all the (quick) answers,
although I did use the Word Help file description on how to remove page
numbers and then found out (to my satisfaction) that the page renumbering
had remained, which solved my problem perfectly.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

The first article I cited does indeed answer your question. It explains that
a page always has a number even when the number is not printed on the page,
and that you can change what this number is using Format Page Number, as you
have apparently figured out for yourself.

 

[Ray Cox]

It answered only part of my question, which was how to change the page
number without having the page number print on the page. If you use either
the Format Page Number feature or any of the schemes to enter a normal or
formulated page number in a footer area, then it automatically turns on page
number printing in the document. There is no single help topic in either
the numbering or indexing area, both of which are affected by what I was
trying to do, that said "here's how to change the document page number
without having the page number print on the page." That took trial and
error and hope.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

If you use either

the Format Page Number feature or any of the schemes to enter a normal or
formulated page number in a footer area, then it automatically turns on page
number printing in the document.

This is simply NOT true. You can set the starting page number for a section
without inserting a page number by using the Format Page Number button on
the Header and Footer toolbar. This does NOT insert a { PAGE } field. You
can
also, if you insist, use the Insert | Page Numbers dialog to do the same
thing, provided you click Close instead of OK.

 

[Ray Cox]

You are missing the point. It's great that you knew that you could
increment page numbers using the Format Page Number button without having
them printed in a document. My point is...where is this found in the Help
system for those of us who didn't know it?

After several hours of searching, which included many page numbering topics,
indexing topics, and even searching specifically for "Format Page Number
button," which didn't result in anything specific about what that button
does/doesn't do, none of these topics stated that the button, or the method
I found and used on my own, could be used to increment page numbering
without printing them, so for the non-expert on Word, there is no direct
path to find this information without trial and error.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

I'm just pointing out that you said the articles I suggested were of no use
to you, and you claimed that you couldn't restart the page numbering without
adding a page number to the page, which is not true.

 

[Ray Cox]

I'm just pointing out that you said the articles I suggested were of no
use
to you,

They weren't...after reading them I still didn't know how to completely do
what I wanted to do, as the article didn't explain everything I needed to
know. Should I have to read 20 articles to find what I need and spend hours
finding it?

and you claimed that you couldn't restart the page numbering without
adding a page number to the page, which is not true.

Again, it is true, because I couldn't do it until you and others told me
something that wasn't to be found in it's entirety in the Help system. In
my logical way of thinking, if I am to use the Format Page Number button,
I'm going to be formatting a page number that either exists or is going to
exist (for printing also, as that seems to be the MS focus) after I use that
feature. Since I didn't want a printing page number at all, why would I be
concerned with formatting it? A direct description of any kind that
described what this button did/didn't do would have helped.

Anyway, I'll let you get the last word, as it seems to be something you
need. I have a document to finish.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

Big Idea #3 in the article at
http://word.mvps.org/FAQs/Numbering/PageNumbering.htm is that every page has
a number (which can be changed) whether that number is printed on the page
or not.

But the critical issue here is that there is a difference between something
being impossible and its being impossible for you because you didn't know
how to do it. You stated that "If you use either the Format Page Number
feature or any of the schemes to enter a normal or formulated page number in
a footer area, then it automatically turns on page number printing in the
document." I merely pointed out that this is not true.

 

[Daiya Mitchell]

Ya know, I just did a quick test and it seems like putting Word's page
number field in a text box works fine to number pages. Anchoring the text
box in the header means it shows up on every page in the same place, and
setting the wrapping to Square wraps text around it.

I'm guessing a frame would also have worked.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

A frame will certainly work, as that's what Insert | Page Numbers uses, but
I assume you're talking about a frame anchored to the text on the page
rather than the header paragraph? Certainly this would work because a {
PAGE } field always reflects the current page number (as defined by Format
Page Number), regardless of where it is placed on the page.