Working with task durations of minutes

[paul.innes]

Hi,

Please accept this question from a relative Newbie.

I have a plan that (hopefully) controls the steps involved in applying
a release of new software.

Having tried to macro-manage the process, I am now micro-managing it,
so some of the tasks end up being only 5 minutes long (or less).

Is there a way I can enter 'Actuals' that include a time, or can I only
enter a date?

Thanks

Chewie

 

[Gérard Ducouret]

Hello,
Tools / Options... / View / Date Format : something with 12:33

Gérard Ducouret

 

[Lowkey]

Paul,

In Project go to "Tools", select "Options", view the tab titled "Schedule",
about 1/2 way down is a drop down menu for duration. You can select minutes,
but your whole project timeline will then be in minutes.

L

 

[Lowkey]

After thinking about this further, you may be better off "grouping" some of
your tasks. For example, you call one of your tasks "Series A" or whatever,
where the Series refers to a known series of tasks: 1,2,3,4 or however many
for the total minutes, say 30. If they can do all the tasks together in less
than 30 minutes, great! If not, you have to go through the series to find the
bottleneck.

Should save you a lot of headache in setting up your schedule, but you may
have to spend more time training your Resources.

 

[John]

Hi,

Please accept this question from a relative Newbie.

I have a plan that (hopefully) controls the steps involved in applying
a release of new software.

Having tried to macro-manage the process, I am now micro-managing it,
so some of the tasks end up being only 5 minutes long (or less).

Is there a way I can enter 'Actuals' that include a time, or can I only
enter a date?

Thanks

Chewie

Chewie,
Just a little piece of advice. Although as both Lowkey and Gerard noted,
the option can be set for entering "actuals" in time values, if you are
micromanaging a project to tasks in minutes you are wasting time on the
minutia. The only type of "project" that MAY make sense to plan in
minutes is a process activity where each step of the process is only a
minute or two (e.g. chemical process). However, software release is NOT
that type of process. I cannot imagine any activity in a software
release process that can be accurately or validly measured in spans of
less than a few days, except perhaps a zero duration release milestone.

It sounds like your current management process is in need of a complete
review. In that review take a big step back and take a hard look at the
end goal or product. Then look at the major measurable activities to
accomplish that end item and lay those out in a plan. If you still find
tasks are being entered with 5 minutes duration, forget Project, you
will be better off (and time/money ahead) to run the project using note
cards (or a PDA in today's world) and a stopwatch.

John
Project MVP

 

[Gérard Ducouret]

Hi John,

<<The only type of "project" that MAY make sense to plan in minutes is a
process activity where each step of the process is only a
minute or two (e.g. chemical process). However, software release is NOT
that type of process. I cannot imagine any activity in a software
release process that can be accurately or validly measured in spans of
less than a few days, >>

Actually, I contributed in a cosmetic company which organizes its
manufacturing processes (more than 1000 a year) with MS Project (Tasks
duration are from 5 to 20 mn). But I contributed also to a software project
in a French bank at the time of changing currency : Franc to Euro.
There were 2 different projects :
- Preparation project : 1000 tasks on the 2 previous years (tasks duration
= 2 to 4 weeks)
- Deployement project : 1000 tasks which had to be executed on the last
week end of the year (1998)
Task Duration : 3 to 5 minutes. (NB : the Network Diagram was a great
help to track the logical sequences)

Regards

Gérard Ducouret

 

[John]

Hi John,

<<The only type of "project" that MAY make sense to plan in minutes is a
process activity where each step of the process is only a
minute or two (e.g. chemical process). However, software release is NOT
that type of process. I cannot imagine any activity in a software
release process that can be accurately or validly measured in spans of
less than a few days, >>

Actually, I contributed in a cosmetic company which organizes its
manufacturing processes (more than 1000 a year) with MS Project (Tasks
duration are from 5 to 20 mn). But I contributed also to a software project
in a French bank at the time of changing currency : Franc to Euro.
There were 2 different projects :
- Preparation project : 1000 tasks on the 2 previous years (tasks duration
= 2 to 4 weeks)
- Deployement project : 1000 tasks which had to be executed on the last
week end of the year (1998)
Task Duration : 3 to 5 minutes. (NB : the Network Diagram was a great
help to track the logical sequences)

Regards

Gérard Ducouret

Gerard,
Let me guess, someone spent more time tracking the project with task
durations of 3 to 5 minutes than it took to actually perform them,
correct?

John

 

[Gérard Ducouret]

Gerard,
Let me guess, someone spent more time tracking the project with task
durations of 3 to 5 minutes than it took to actually perform them,
correct?

John

Hi John,
In fact, in the example of implementation of software, they spent more time
to plan it than to carry out it. But if they had not planned it, they would
have spent much more than 2 days to carry out it, and the project would have
probably failed.

Gérard

 

[John]

Hi John,

In fact, in the example of implementation of software, they spent more time
to plan it than to carry out it. But if they had not planned it, they would
have spent much more than 2 days to carry out it, and the project would have
probably failed.

Gérard

Gerard,
Believe it or not, I'm a big fan of investing time in planning. I guess
it's kinda like painting a room (or whatever). It can take hours or even
days of prep work and only a few minutes or hours to paint.

I have to apologize for perhaps being so hard on the poster (Chewie) in
my reply. My alarm went off when I read the word "micromanage". Since he
admittedly is a "newbie" I felt he was going in the wrong direction, but
as you pointed out, there are circumstances where short duration tasks
are appropriate.

John

 

[paul.innes]

Hi guys,

Thanks very much for your replies. I'll try to cover both points that
have been raised.

1. Yes I am a relative newbie to using MSProject (and also
micro-managing). However, as they say, "the devil is the detail". To
give a bit more background, We are currently getting regular (2 weekly)
releases from our software supplier. This is a big implementation of a
new line of business system (I work for a big Life Insurance Company).
On the plan there are about 250 tasks (including summaries) that need
to be completed when installng each of these releases. The plan was
initially intended as a 'check-list' to make sure that all the little
things that needed to be done were, in fact, done.

However, documenting this list as a project plan gave a number of
benefits in terms of parallel tasking and duration estimates.

I can certainly roll up some tasks, but I really need to see them as
individual items so they can be checked off.

2. Thanks for the info on how to set up the plan to display all
durations in minutes. What I was really looking for though was how to
input 'actual' start
and end times (rather than dates). In the Task Information screen I
can only enter dates (I think). I've tried add "15:00" next to the
date, but am unsure of the impact/effectiveness of this.

Thanks again,

Chewie

 

[John]

Hi guys,

Thanks very much for your replies. I'll try to cover both points that
have been raised.

1. Yes I am a relative newbie to using MSProject (and also
micro-managing). However, as they say, "the devil is the detail". To
give a bit more background, We are currently getting regular (2 weekly)
releases from our software supplier. This is a big implementation of a
new line of business system (I work for a big Life Insurance Company).
On the plan there are about 250 tasks (including summaries) that need
to be completed when installng each of these releases. The plan was
initially intended as a 'check-list' to make sure that all the little
things that needed to be done were, in fact, done.

However, documenting this list as a project plan gave a number of
benefits in terms of parallel tasking and duration estimates.

I can certainly roll up some tasks, but I really need to see them as
individual items so they can be checked off.

2. Thanks for the info on how to set up the plan to display all
durations in minutes. What I was really looking for though was how to
input 'actual' start
and end times (rather than dates). In the Task Information screen I
can only enter dates (I think). I've tried add "15:00" next to the
date, but am unsure of the impact/effectiveness of this.

Thanks again,

Chewie

Chewie,
If the short duration tasks work for you, then great. I still have my
reservations on the value of micromanaging but that's just my humble
opinion.

With regard to inputting time into any date field all you need to do is
enter the value. It doesn't matter if you enter the value as a 24 hour
value (i.e. 15:00) or a 12 hour value (i.e. 3:00 pm).

Hope this helps.
John

 

[Steve House [Project MVP]]

Adding to John's comments, one of the pitfalls of your approach is that
Project is best used to figure out the schedule you need to follow, not just
to document what you've already decided will be the schedule and check off
performance against it. If Joe is to be updating the server with module X,
do you really need to document each individual miniscule step he must take?
If I were Joe, I'd be really ticked off at you for not trusting me to know
how to do my job. Just tell me I'm responsible for updating the server,
everything will be "go" for me to do it starting Tuesday afternoon, and then
get out of my way and let me do my job <grin>. From a project managment
perspective it's usually enough for the PM to say "Update Server with Module
Package X, 5 hours duration, starting Tuesday 1pm" and leave it up to Joe
how he organizaes the details. We could care less if he copies File XYZ
between 14:00 and 14:10 or between 14:42 and 14:57. All that really matters
from a planning standpoint is the server will be down for upgrades starting
Tuesday 13:00 and back online with the upgrades done Tuesday about 18:00.
Especially in IT projects many PMs use what is called the "8/80 Rule" as a
guideline - if you're working with tasks much under 8 hours duration you're
micromanaging way too much, losing sight of the big picture in a morass of
pointless detail, and if your tasks are longer than about 80 hours you're
probably erring in the opposite direction, not decomposing the work into
enough detail.

I like to approach it from the standpoint of detailing the tasks down to a
one task - one resource correspondence, "resource" meaning in this context a
skill package of one or more individuals. If I'm painting a room and the
painter and his assistant (one skill package with two individuals) will box
up the computers in it, move the furniture out, remove fixtures from the
wall, mix and apply the paint I'll just list it as one task "Paint the
Room." But if people from IT are coming in to box up and move out the
computer equipment, a team of laborers to move out the furniture, union
rules require it is a carpenter who takes down the wall fixtures, then the
painter mixes and applies the paint, "Paint the Room" becomes a summary task
with those individual activities detailed under it.