How can I split a project day into hours to avoid overallocation?

D

DannyB

Hello all,

I am still facing overallocation problems.

I have looked at other posts (including Jan's); but, I am having trouble
resolving the over allocation.

For example:

It seems to me that - if two tasks happen on the same day (even if they are
both 2 hours long and the working day is set to 8 hours) MS Project makes
them clash.

How can I say - set one task to start at 9-11am and one to start at 1-3pm?

Surely this will avoind the overallocation.

Why doesn't MS Project seem to realsie that:

if the working day is 8 hours and someone is working 100% on a 4 hour task,
attending a one hour meeting 100% and doing 10% of a task with a duration of
50 days - an 8 hour day should accomodate all the tasks and effort.

Surely, it shouldn't show as 210% over allocation? Or is it me?

Thanks.

d.
 
M

Mike Glen

Hi Danny,

Welcome to this Microsoft Project newsgroup :)

Two ways. Use Project's built-in process of levelling - Tools/Level Resources... Project will delay tasks until the resources are available. The other way is to use a Usage view to enter the hours by day that you need to separate the tasks and give the resource a continuous run. Project has no intelligence and you have to tell it what you want it to do.

FAQs, companion products and other useful Project information can be seen at this web address: http://project.mvps.org/faqs.htm

Hope this helps - please let us know how you get on :)

Mike Glen
MS Project MVP
See http://tinyurl.com/2xbhc for my free Project Tutorials



Hello all,

I am still facing overallocation problems.

I have looked at other posts (including Jan's); but, I am having trouble
resolving the over allocation.

For example:

It seems to me that - if two tasks happen on the same day (even if they are
both 2 hours long and the working day is set to 8 hours) MS Project makes
them clash.

How can I say - set one task to start at 9-11am and one to start at 1-3pm?

Surely this will avoind the overallocation.

Why doesn't MS Project seem to realsie that:

if the working day is 8 hours and someone is working 100% on a 4 hour task,
attending a one hour meeting 100% and doing 10% of a task with a duration of
50 days - an 8 hour day should accomodate all the tasks and effort.

Surely, it shouldn't show as 210% over allocation? Or is it me?

Thanks.

d.
 
J

Jan De Messemaeker

Hi,
Can you attend 2 meetings at 8:00 simultaneously? Most people don't have the
gift of bilocation.
Project warns you of this problem. You ARE 210% loaded between 8 and 9.
If you say I don't care, all I'm interested in is dayly workload, then don't
worry about the "redness" of a resoruce.
How can you check a day level overallocation?
Set the leveling step at "day by day".
Now in a resource view look for the yellow diamonds in the indicator column.

If you insist on removing the redness, there are three ways.

1. In each resource view, Format menu, Text Styles, select as "item to
change" Overallocated resources, and change the font color from red to any
color you do allow
2.OR, as you seem to be doing resoruce leveling anyhow, take "minute by
minute" as the step. That will remove all redness.
3. Of course you can do it manually by setting the start date yourself as
4/5/10 11:12 but that is not using Project, just producing colors.

Hope this helps,

--
Jan De Messemaeker
Microsoft Project Most Valuable Professional
+32 495 300 620
For availability check:
http://users.online.be/prom-ade/Calendar.pdf
 
D

DannyB

Thank you Glen!

I have been on the site behind your link several times already looking into
over allocation.

And, I have tried leveling.

If a 4 hour task is set to 'must start on' a given day and that day also has
a one hour long meeting (MS Project says it cannot level), the day of the
task has to be moved to level or the resource graph will show the resource
as overallocated. Even though the tasks only amount to 5 hours in an eight
hour day.

This cannot be right; can you really only have one task per day, apart from
milestones, unless you are happy to see red in the resource graph.

I have looked into the usage sheet to; but, you cannot apply tasks to the
hours from what I can see.

Thanks and more pointers please?

danny.

*****************************************************
 
M

Mike Glen

You have given Project conflicting orders - you've told it that it must start the task on that day and then scheduled a meeting at the same time. Try Tools/Options.../View tab and select a Date format that includes time. Now decide which of the 2 tasks has priority and change the must start on date to include the time at which you want it to start. Otherwise, delete the constraint and re-level. This shows up the fallacy of setting constraints on tasks - don't do it!

Mike Glen
Project MVP
See http://tinyurl.com/2xbhc for my free Project Tutorials


Thank you Glen!

I have been on the site behind your link several times already looking into
over allocation.

And, I have tried leveling.

If a 4 hour task is set to 'must start on' a given day and that day also has
a one hour long meeting (MS Project says it cannot level), the day of the
task has to be moved to level or the resource graph will show the resource
as overallocated. Even though the tasks only amount to 5 hours in an eight
hour day.

This cannot be right; can you really only have one task per day, apart from
milestones, unless you are happy to see red in the resource graph.

I have looked into the usage sheet to; but, you cannot apply tasks to the
hours from what I can see.

Thanks and more pointers please?

danny.

*****************************************************
 
D

DannyB

Thanks again!

I think that I may be looking to deeply into the situation.

In a new chart, I have just set up four conflicting tasks: a recurring
meeting; task one; task two and task three.

Now, if I set 2 of them to start on the same day and the other two to start
on the same day - I can; but:

- there is the red in over allocation (I'm not bothered about that now I
know what it is)

- Project will not level if I insist on keeping them on the same day.

So, I think that I am just going to have to live with the fact that I cannot
understand why MS Project just doesn't realise that two tasks on the same day
might actually be at different times; it just seems to presume that they are
at the same time?

Thanks everyone; your help was very useful and much appreciated.

Dan.

*******************************************************
 
J

Jan De Messemaeker

Hi,

I absolutely do not understand you here.
When you only enter the day for a task Project assumes it starts at the
beginning of the working time. What else? A random number??
You can change this manually (by entering the date AND time such as 10/9/10
10:11) OR ask Project's leveling to do it but then you have to set the
leveling parameters to a sufficient granularity such as minute by minute.

Hope this helps,


--
Jan De Messemaeker
Microsoft Project Most Valuable Professional
+32 495 300 620
For availability check:
http://users.online.be/prom-ade/Calendar.pdf
 
S

Steve House

Remember that time is ALWAYS part of the start, finish, constraint, etc date
fields whether you display it or not. That task with a Must Start On
constraint of a certain date also has a fixed time on that date, say 8am.
That means it is immovable, even if only to shift it an hour later in the
day from when it's presently scheduled. By putting on the constraint, you
have told Project that the task will start on, say, March 15th at 8am and
that is engraved in granite. If for some reason the meeting is also
immovable, perhaps due to a constraint on it as well (Finish No Later Than
is especially common), then you have tied Project's hands and there's
nothing it can do with it.

I can't say it over enough - the percentage allocation DOES NOT actually
reflect the amount of the resource's workday he devotes to a task. The
allocation percentage is the amount of any arbitrarily selected duration
time interval that is actually reflected in full-time equivalent man-hours
of work accomplished. If the resource does one man-hour of work and spends
one hour of clock time to do it, he's allocated 100% for one hour even if
that's the only thing he is scheduled to do during his entire 8-hour
workday. On the other hand, if he dawdles along and takes a day to do what
he could have got done in 1 hour had he devoted his full attention to it,
he''s allocated 12.5% for one entire day day. But note - the task's start
time will be 8am and its finish 5 pm for a duration of 1 day, NOT 1 hour..
A resource is overallocatied when he's scheduled to do be in two places at
once, even if the overlap is only for one single minute.

You can certainly have more than one task per day ... your guy can work on
his 4-hour task during the morning and go to the meeting in the afternoon.
OR if the meeting is not movable, say it's a staff meeting from 8am to 9am,
you have to ease up on the constraint on the other task and let leveling
make its start shift to later in the day after the meeting is over. If the
resource truly does have to work on two things at once, you can have them
run concurrently by assigning him only 50% on each but then you'll have to
live with the fact that it will take him twice as long to finish each one.
And many things such as meetings rationally CAN'T be anything other than
100% - could he reasonably be expected to be in a meeting discussing
department objectives at the same time he's writing a program or painting a
wall? Not likely.

Try to avoid constraints if at all possible - they have their uses but
should be relatively rare in your project, used only when necessary to model
a physical certainty. For example, if parts needed for a certain task won't
arrive from the vendor before April 15th, it is certainly reasonable to put
a Start No Earlier Than constraint on the task to reflect that reality. In
your example, if the meeting is going to happen at that date and time
regardless of your project's needs or the resource's work schedule an MSO
constraint on the meeting reflects that reality. But for the other 4 hour
task, if you put on the constraint because that's when you want him to work
on it or you think that's a convenient time for him to work on it or even
that's when it ought to happen so the project finishes on time, the MSO
constraint is not justified and should be removed. People often use MSO,
MFO, SNLT, or FNLT in an attempt to force the plan into a schedule they have
predetermined to be the one they want and that is a serious mistake.
Project is not designed to document a schedule you have already determined
elsewhere. It is intended to tell you the dates (and times) that tasks are
able to happen, not reflect the dates and times you want them to happen or
even NEED them to happen, no matter how badly.
 
S

Steve House

As I said in my other message, you have told them they must be at the same
time. Perhaps inadvertently, but the constraints that force the tasks to
that date also force them to a specific time on that date. Go to the Tools
Options menu, the View tab and select a date display that includes the time
and you'll see what I mean. Time always, without exception, a part of every
date field even if you don't choose to display it.
 
D

DannyB

Thanks Steve and Jan,

I don't know how I missed your post Steve? Perhaps, we posted at the same
time - apologies.

The use of the word 'time' and not date confused me a little; because, as
far as I can see there is no way to set a task to start at a specific time.

I think that I fully understand the concepts that you have explained to me.
And, I thought that I understood the allocation issue that Jan explained to
me; however:

I have just set up a recurring meeting to happen every Tuesday for 1 hour
with me and two others attending; the first Tuesday was the 16th March 2010.
On the same date (16th March), I have added a four hour task to be also
completed by me - no problem at all!

The allocation is set at 100% with no red (so the one task per day and you
are over allocated argument doesn't stand) and MS Project doesn't
automatically move any tasks to the next day.

Last night I was trying to add similar tasks into phase 3 of an ongoing
project plan in MS Project and I was running into difficulties.

I do not know why that when I set up the four task plan to simply test the
theory, the tasks clashed then too.

Either way, it does seem to be possible to do what I wanted to do yesterday
- today.

I cannot say that originally it was conflicting tasks, as - I right clicked
on the date in the calendar, used 'go to', to see the tasks on that date and
there were only the meeting and the other task there - no others!

So, as you guys say, it is surely to do with how the tasks are constrained.

I hope that sounds right.

Dan

PS/ Of course I know that Ausies use, 'you beauty'. My uncle has two music
shops over there - one in Melbourne and one in Blackburn; they are called
Music Junction - I am having a tinny as I write this!


**********************************************************
 
D

DannyB

Thanks Jan,

I totally understand that by default Project sets tasks to start at a
default time; how do i set the time (say to 10.11 as in your post) as well as
the date please?

Thaks,

dan.


**********************************************************
 
R

Rob Schneider

Dan,

Far as I know, there is no way to set the default start time (as in
clock time). This would only apply anyway to tasks where you specify a
constraint.
Normally, it would be very unusual to build a schedule model with more
than a few (if any) constraints.

So if you feel the need to have date/time constrained tasks, then just
specify the date/time when you set the constraint.

The better approach is always, though, to build a schedule model with no
constraints that achieve the date/time schedule you target for.


--rms

www.rmschneider.com
 
M

Mike Glen

To answer your question, Danny - if you must have a specific time, you type it in after the date as in Jan's example. This won't be a default start time as that is set in Tools/Options.../Calendar tab.

Mike Glen
Project MVP
See http://tinyurl.com/2xbhc for my free Project Tutorials


Thanks Jan,

I totally understand that by default Project sets tasks to start at a
default time; how do i set the time (say to 10.11 as in your post) as well as
the date please?

Thaks,

dan.


**********************************************************
 

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